Do you guys like photoshopped models

[MelodyChase]

Oh I love Tiggerrs eyelashes very sexy

Melodyx

[Ron T. Storm]

A lovely photo there. And that is where my point about photoshop comes full cirlcle. Your photo is lovely and shows what you can do with the right lighting, right angle and great model without having to photoshop. A superb photo Simon & Tigerr.

Stormchild69

[Porn Baron]

Simon your pics are fantastic. I think your models look relaxed and happy to do the dirty dead. Don't know how you do it but you could make a steaming dog turd look sexy. Hope that's a compliment?

[Benson_Media]

LOL

Thanks Baron. That is indeed taken as a compliment.

There's a lot of crap models out there at the moment and to be honest using photoshop as a concealer and makeup in post isn't good enough. If I wanted to look at bleached out textureless FHM style faces I'd paper my bedroom with posters of Michael Jackson.

Having said that, some seventy percent of the models we use in the UK need photoshopping. Why some models think they can turn up to a shoot with black eye bags, zits the size of raisins, smelling of tuna and fags is beyond me. Even further beyond me when they bitch and cry about not being photoshopped enough.

It's the models responsibility to turn up looking good.

So come on ladies - more sleep, more veg and fruit. And, if you're retarded enough to think smoking won't dry out your skin..atleast invest some of your lung cancer fund in some top notch moisturising cream.

It'll save us guys having to polish turds.

[Daz Savage]

Hi Simon.
You have mentioned a point I touched on before that no-one seems to have run with yet.
Photoshop (or similar) is simply make-up in post-production. If you have good make-up beforehand (as you obviously have in your latest pic of Tigerr) then much of what one might do in the 'digital darkroom' to improve the model will be unnecessary.
The question I would like to raise is, why do so many people get all fascist about any photographer changing lighting or skin appearance after the curtain drops (so-to-speak) but will applaud the work of a 'togger if he/she makes changes in lighting beforehand?
For me the process is and always will be an organic one. I shoot to the best of my ability using whatever tools I have to hand and then after reviewing the work I see what else I can to make it better for the customer... the customer that is - not better for me.
I think that the real issue here - the one that seems to be keeping us talking is that we are artists (oh yes we are) who have to make a living in an industry that has its claws deep in our psyche. So on the one hand we know what we would like to do for art, but then know what we must do for our work, but this then sometimes conflicts with what we we desire to do for ourselves and then we mix that with impression we hope we are giving to our peers.

Personally, I will continue to use all the tools at my disposal and any webmaster who says they don't or would never use such tools is welcome to say so.

[Benson_Media]

Hi Daz

We're all (supposed) to be professionals. I bring a half decent camera and bit of skill using it, the model brings her pretty mug.

Simple as that.

But if said mug has been previously photoshopped in every picture I've seen by well meaning photographers..and model turns up with faceful of golf ball skin, whose fault is that?

Would you feel cheated if you bought a car on ebay and later found all the dents had been airbrushed out?

From our Model Bible:

3. Markings such as tattoos, bruises, scars, stretch marks, spots, acne, shaving rashes should be mentioned before the shoot. Most of the time we can fix marks but only if we are made aware of them before the shoot.

4. Arriving with basic makeup on with concealer for any zits or blemishes is very cool and will earn you diva-like treatment or atleast a cup of tea.

5. The photos you send us should be recent. Changes in weight, appearance, such as haircuts or hair color, suntans, fake tans should not be a surprise to us on shoot day.

http://www.bensonmodels.com/shoot_rules.html

[Daz Savage]

Hi Simon.
You Write.
"But if said mug has been previously photoshopped in every picture I've seen by well meaning photographers..and model turns up with faceful of golf ball skin, whose fault is that?

Would you feel cheated if you bought a car on ebay and later found all the dents had been airbrushed out?"

Interesting point there but there is something important to remember...
Other photographers/sites are not my concern - only my members (potential and current). I don't really care if a model mis-represents herself to others since it's the responsibility of others to check her out properly - it's not my job to publish work that acts simply as a portfolio for the models concerned.

I think your Model Bible is useful and written in a very fun and humorous way but it's really not for other photographers to worry about your requirements when they do their work.
You write.
"5. The photos you send us should be recent. Changes in weight, appearance, such as haircuts or hair color, suntans, fake tans should not be a surprise to us on shoot day."

That's fine but what's that to do with my working day? What if someone worked with a model on a fine art site and was horrified that someone they had portrayed as a top-end fashion/glamour diva was now covered in jizz on your site? Personally I think that's not a problem but going by your rules (that I have to keep you in mind whilst I do my work) then wouldn't the same rules have to apply to you?
If you want me to observe your bible and represent girls as they truly are... then can I have the option to write some rules that insist other photographers airbrush girls who I think need it and shoot them in a way that's in-keeping with my site's ethos instead of their own? - No, of course I can't because it is manifest nonsense.

Again, your Model Bible is a great idea but it's for the model to worry about not me. And if one does turns up with 'golf-ball' skin as you call it then surely you didn't hire her just for her skin (just like everyone else) so why not do something to flatten it out a bit? - before and after (again, just like everyone else).

I hope you don't take offense at this reply but although you make 100% sense most of the time I have to say I think you've missed the mark by miles on this one by suggesting that any photographer about to retouch their own images should consider anything other than their own customer base.

[Benson_Media]

Hi Daz

No offence taken whatsover.

But in answer to:

"...suggesting that any photographer about to retouch their own images should consider anything other than their own customer base."

Retouching is never a problem and of course you're right in stating it's nonsensical to insist photographers don't retouch at all. But that's not what I was saying.

I'm talking about the situations whereby a model's face is blitzed by photoshop.

It's only natural for a model to pick only the best most flattering (and maybe sometimes falsely flattering) photos for her portfolio. An unsuspecting photographer could make the mistake that what you see is what you get, when sometimes it's quite clearly not.

In our specific situation it is worthwhile for a model to phone ahead and tell us she has a shaving rash or a break out of spots because of monthly women's things so we can pack the right makeup or rescript before we get on a plane.

But I wonder Daz, what would happen if wholesale all photographers stopped photoshopping models spots, eyebags, blisters, rashes or bruises.

Would models take more care of their appearance or would we just have lots of grubby looking porn?

[Daz Savage]

Agreed on that one Simon.
I hate that glam-chic, blitzed, 'free makeover & buy your own photos darlin', twenty years younger or your wrinkles back guaranteed look.
H have found myself forced to do it on occasion when I have done a test-shoot with a girl who I'm trying to convince that they're good enough to model... but you're right - it's a crap ethos to have on a day-to-day basis.
The FHM (wax-coated) look is a turn-off for me and except for the sake of art and to prove to myself that I can actually do it (I like to expand my repertoire occasionally) I don't practice it.

You make a great point about what would models do if we all refused to filter their work... I think that those that could do something might get off their arses and try a bit harder and those that can't would be a bit stuck.
I have forever tried to convince models that this is a job and to act accordingly but it's all a waste of time in the main. In the UK the vast majority of young people think that modeling is a get-out-of-work free card and take no real care of their appearance whatsoever - even appearing to do as much as they possibly can (it would seem) to destroy their looks by having late nights every day of the week on the run-up to their shoot.
I remember showing one model some pictures of her before editing and the black marks under her eyes shocked her into remarking that she should perhaps smoke less dope prior to her next shoot with me... what next shoot!
I will say, as I always say, anyone who wants to make themselves big in this business needs to keep themselves looking good (and healthy), to do this above and below the neck!, to promote themselves appropriately - intelligently - diligently and constantly and then to fucking TURN UP!

Alas...