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So Bimmer, you're actually quite happy that Bush sat in his chair reading stories to kids while he knew America was under attack?

I wouldn't expect him to have, "jumped wildly out of his seat and started running around" but I might have expected him to maybe put his book down and, ooh I don't know, found out exactly what was happening to his country, how many had died, what the situation in New York was, find out if other planes had been hijacked and where they were going.

In short, take charge of the situation.

As I've said, I'm not pro-Moore or anti-Bush.

Anyone with half a brain who has read one of Moore's books or seen his films would know that he's putting a spin on things and edits very cleverly.

I'm a huge fan of America (I wouldn't have moved here otherwise) and dislike the lazy assumptions about this country just as much as you do.

What really used to bug me back in England was Brits who would churn out that tired old stat that '87% of Americans don't have passports' as if that somehow marks them out as ignorant non-travelling morons.

And this from people whose idea of travel is to go Majorca once a year so they can drink lager, read British newspapers and eat fish and chips while they burn their ignorant faces in the sun.

Bimmercat wrote:

> Last time I checked...abortion was perfectly legal in all US
> states...that argument doesn't wash.

Table 5. Number of counties and number and percentage of counties without an abortion provider

quote: "In 41 states, a majority of counties had no provider, including 21 states where more than 90% of counties had none."

so, it's not so much an issue of legality, as of restricted availability due to clinics being harrassed into closure by the relentlessly confontational tactics adopted by pro-life campaigners (including bombing and murder).

> Which EU products were banned from importation to the USA?

'Bush slaps tariffs on steel imports'

quote: "The brunt of the duties will hit steel from China, Japan, Russia, Brazil, South Korea, Ukraine and the European Union."

furthermore: 'Bush's Steel Tariffs Not the First Instance of Hypocrisy on Free Trade'

of course, the usa's double standards regarding agricultural subsidies is replicated in spades by the european union.

Its interesting that Moore makes a big deal about Mr Bush reading to school kids for several minutes after the news came through. I seem to remember watching the live news as it was happening and at one point they switched to Senator Kennedy who was expected to make some sort of statement about the situation. He was also at a school somewhere talking about his education policy. He almost dismissed the attacks at that stage and said that a few terrorists weren't going to interupt his agenda and continued on. Sure, he wasn't the President, but if Moore was even slightly fair minded he would have mentioned this.

And Bimmercat - dont think the rest of the world is against your country just because the media covers anti-USA protests all the time. Heaps of people I know are grateful that the USA is strong enough to act when needed. I always ask the question - " If you didn't have America as the dominant power who would you rather have ? Russia ? China ? "

Gee thanks Bimmercat. I need you to save me from anything like I need a hole in the head.
Do you realise how you come across as a one patronising b******.

Mart

Aren't you confusing him with his brother Peter?

Mart

Christopher is the leftie. Wrote a blistering attack on Kissinger.
But he's taken a controversial line on Iraq. Thinks the invasion was justified because Saddam was a bad man. Perhaps he's been in the US too long.

Peter used to write for the Express, I think he's with the Mail now.

Mart

Oops. Apologies to Bimmercat.

I was deeply disappointed: Moore used (abused?) Columbine as a mere starting block for his anti-gun tirade, when really here was a chance to take a focused look at the myriad sociological issues facing US youth today. And even on this Moore fudged it with generalisms and a socio-political rhetoric that often spun on a thin dime: the local missile base did nothing more sinister than put satellites into orbit, but I can?t recall Moore telling us that. Gus van Zandt's fictitious Elephant proved more affecting on the subject.

F 9/11 I will approach with caution, but Sicko, his next opus concerning US mental health issues, sounds promising.

Hey Bimmer, you seen this?