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Re: Jews and Isreal.

Posted: Thu Mar 30, 2006 4:33 pm
by Kelly Steele
Speaking as a Canadienne Jew. (And that's a woman that is half-french Canadienne and half-native north american indian.)

It's a little more complicated than what Europe and North America is seeing.


It's ISRAEL!

Posted: Thu Mar 30, 2006 5:48 pm
by DanG
...not 'Isreal'!

Re: Jews and Israel.

Posted: Thu Mar 30, 2006 6:11 pm
by Jacques
What Europe and North America are seeing is ?????'s You see where ever there is misery there is someone making money. What America and the UK have been doing is loaning vast sums of money to Israel so that they can then buy Military aircraft, spare parts, guns, ammunition etc. from them. In effect arming them and charging them twice.....


Re: It's ISRAEL!

Posted: Thu Mar 30, 2006 6:27 pm
by stripeysydney
I know, I know, I was just lazy, could'nt be bothered to check in the dictionary. I realised that when I wrote it... apologies.

Re: Jews and Israel.

Posted: Fri Mar 31, 2006 7:23 am
by Kelly Steele
Israel is very good with it's military.

What happens more than not is the nation purchases the military equipment. Improves it and sells the modified product back to the origional makers.

The last time I was in Israel I had the fortune of sitting down with a pilot. He informed me that the united states spent millions trying to solve a problem with a blind spot in the F15. They sold the plane to Isreal and inside of a week the solution was created.

Some mechanic walked over to the vehicle repair shop. Grabbed a review mirror and then went and mounted it on the canopy. It was a quick and cheap fix for a problem that no one could think around. Such is the way the tribe works. Israel is a nation that is surrounded by it's enemies and in a state of war since it's begining.


Re: Jews and Israel.

Posted: Tue Apr 04, 2006 11:05 am
by chatterji
A couple of points to toss in.

Israel's fortress mentality has partly been forged by the aggression of the Arab peoples that surround it. It, in turn, has escalated their animosity by its uncompromising and aggressive stance. Blood is on the hands of every one of the participants in the area and each side has its share of lunatics. It maddens me that liberals here are often so pro-Palestinian without recognising this fact. To pledge support for Hamas in Palestine at some Hampstead party is obscene. Why don't people like the fucking Redgraves ever go to Israel and see the inncocent Jewish dead of the conflict? Why is their focus only on the innocents of one side? It's easy to side with David against Goliath without recognising that David too is flawed.

Israel is a democratic state, (unless you happen to be Arab), founded as a homeland primarily for Jews. There are more Jews outside Israel than in it. Israel does not represent or speak for the Jewish people of the world. It speaks for Israel. In this country the liberal intelligentsia, and certain Muslim elements, have talked of 'Jewish aggression' in the East ,which goes hand in glove with their support of Palestine. This kind of stance has given rise to situations such as that in the National Union of Students Executive in England, where Jewish students became objects of abuse for being Jewish and therefore 'Israeli'. It also led to an attempt to exclude Israeli universities (a voice of moderation in Israel) from global academic life by sectors of the British academic community. This is absurd. It's completely unacceptable to hold Muslims in the UK responsible for the actions of Muslims elsewhere, (and imagine the outcry if people did that here). That has to cut both ways. Jewish people regularly criticise the actions of Israel from both inside and outside the country. If only Muslims were as prepared to point the finger at Palestine for its flaws.

The ONLY solution for Israel and Palestine is international mediation and a neutral zone to separate, permanently, both sides. Only when a ceasefire is in place can pressure be brought to bear on both sides to compromise and broker an agreement that will respect both states. The past can't be undone. But a new future can be made if people are strong enough to put the past away. Look at South Africa.