Ben Kinsella: A racist murder?

[max_tranmere]

number 6, I think a large proportion of people who vote BNP are poor white people who feel they are totally ignored by the main 3 parties. I've said this on one or two other posts. If you live in some decrepid part of Oldham, Burnley or Bradford and the main 3 parties spend all the time visiting the Asian areas and bending over backwards for them and none of them have EVER been to your street, then when the BNP come knocking, come over as people who care, and they say to you 'we want to turn this estate into the proud place it once was' it is not surprising that some people, who are skint and neglected, will vote for them. I want to make clear again that that is NOT me. I'm not poor, but if I was, and fitted every other bit of critieria I've outlined here, I may well vote for them. I am sure what I've just said though will do nothing to stop people calling me a BNP supporter in comments that will follow this one, but if they want to do that they can. I can't stop them. They are incorrect when they say it (I voted UKIP last week and at the 2 previous Euro elections aswell).

But back to the original subject: I look forward to the day when something like the Ben Kinsella murder is called 'racist' and the three scumbags who did it are referred to as that on TV news programmes - just like three white killers would be if they murdered a black person. And I look forward to the day when places like the Stephen Lawrence Centre (or whatever it is called) in south London actually helps poor white people who may apply to it for help, and I look forward to the day when the Black Police Association stops just helping ethnic minorities and shutting the door in the face of white officers who may come to them for help - purely because the white officer is the wrong colour, and I look forward to the day when the BNP lifts its whites-only membership policy. Do you think those days will ever come? I especially look forward to the day when anti white racism is identified and villified as much as 'white on ethnic minority' racism is recognised and villified. Sadly I dont think any of those days are particularly near...

[belfast_birty]

It's all part of the Gobment drive for ''Diversity''.Hence no criticism of anyone who might be ethnically challenged,regardless of their role as either perpetrator or victim.

[mrmcfister]

I wasn't in court but sounds like a brutish attack because some guy had been show disrespect.He got a couple of mates and this lad was stabbed 17 times.In the USA they would serve 99 years .In this land though they'll be out after 10.This government has failed dismally on law and order.It has made hundreds of un-enforceable laws but still this sort of thuggish thing goes on and will not be properly punished.I would happily pull the trap door for these three cunts.

[steve56]

They should get life but i doubt they will somehow

[one eyed jack]

Well they did get life Steve and deservedly so. Imagine the shame those guys have brought to their famillies for what they have done.

I doubt it was a racist murder because black kids get stabbed by other black kids on a daily basis for the same thing all the time.

I guess you just dont read it in the newspaper though its been in the papers for years now but it seems the disenfranchised among you want to see everything involving white people as racist.

Maybe it was, but does the racist motive make it somehow more acceptable to you?

They killed that poor guy for talking back as an act of disrespect. Not sure how that made it racist. I believe in this case the fact that ben Kinsella was white was incidental because he could have very well ended up the same way if he was black.

To racists Im sure that would be acceptable until it happens to someone else of their own team colour eh?

[steve56]

Ive been reading about it it dosent sound like a racist murder im afraid he was in the wrong place at the wrong time could happen anywhere really

[randyandy]

Like others I sincerely doubt that this was a racist murder more about 3 pricks 'being disrespected' but can fully understand the point Max is trying to make.

You can almost guarantee this would have been the first angle the media would have looked at, even though the celebrity link existed.

It's incredibly hard to make a point on this without coming across as having no sympathy for Ben or his family but I have to repeat if a 16 year old wasn't out in a pub celebrating and in turn braking the law himself, he simply wouldn't have been in the situation to be murdered.

Obviously nobody should ever be 'in the situation' but for the family to keep making references about him being good and just out celebrating annoys me because it comes across as there being one rule for them and another for the rest of the kids.

[max_tranmere]

One eyed jack and steve: whether it was specifically a racist murder is not the issue, it is the fact that if some white guys murdered a black guy it would always be called a racist murder by the media and by politicans, and everyone else, even if it specifically wasnt - so to all intents and purposes a white on black murder IS a racist murder (as referring to it like that makes it that) and something like this (black on white) is not referred to as racist therefore, to all intents and purposes NOT racist. It's not about what something is on an objective level is it about what something is viewed as being and that it what makes it what it is. 'A racist murder' isnt determined as being that by some official government panel or similar, it just gets referred to as being that by the media usually and then it IS that as a result. So white on black IS racist and the other way around generally isnt (as we've seen with Ben Kinsella here - a distinct lack of the use of the word 'racist' in any of the coverage). I would like both kinds of thing to be referred to in the same way. If white on black is racist, then black on white is too.

[max_tranmere]

andy, you are right he shouldnt have been in the pub but any lad of 16 or 17 will go to a pub, or drink alcohol with his mates in the park, if he can get away with it. He probably told his parents he was round at a mates house or out celebrating in a cafe but went there instead. Most teens do things they are not supposed to. I've just seen the CCTV footage of what happened on the BBC news and it proves how non-effectual CCTV is. They showed the aftermath but it did nothing to prevent what happened, I mean the existence of CCTV is hardly a deterent and we have seen crime increase, rather than decrease, since it was introduced.

[randyandy]

Sorry Max

I just don't go for the it's what all teens do excuse and with some of the behaviour we see every day, of every week , which is down to nothing more than drunk teens I wish others would start to feel the same.

His parents knew what he was doing, after the court case announced what he was doing and if I recall even went as far as saying he should have been allowed to be out celebrating.

You're actually wrong about CCTV people are actually crying out for it in a number of areas and not getting it.

The reason why most fail is for the same reasons that speed camera's predominantly fail and that's because those causing the issues don't give a fuck.

One of the murderers of those French students knew full well CCTV was in place and put his hand up in some pathetic attempt to hide himself. He knew it was there and did his actions to prevent being seen but didn't give a fuck about doing the crime.

It's the same reason why some shoplifters carry on as they do even if the store has security guards.

The fact there is a deterrent in place means nothing to some while others won't do the crime in that store because of the security in place.