African aid

[David Johnson]

Made contributions to charity. Not that it is any of your business.

Cheers
D

[David Johnson]

"Can you spare me a few quid ,
I won't pay you back ,

say ?1000 .

Oh why Not ?"

No. The reasons for that are:

1. You are not starving.
2. You have access to medical help.

Any more daft questions?

Cheers
D

[David Johnson]

"dear David

please pray to your God ,
Perhaps he will be able to help.

Seeing as you feel so fucking righteous"

Not righteous, just helping. Is helping your neighbour, righteous? I don't think so. Is helping your family, righteous? I don't think so? Is trying to do a little to help others not as fortunate as you, righteous? I don't think so.

I live in one of the biggest economies in the world and despite coming from what would be termed a relatively poor family background. I have had a lot of benefits. Helping others in a small way is no big deal to me.

Obviously it seems to be destroying you since you bang on about it endlessly.

Cheers
D

[David Johnson]

"Yawn"

Yeah, I guess non-stop hatred of others less well off than yourself is a bit tiring.

Maybe you need to lie down in a nice warm bed, wake up and have a good breakfast.

Then go back to hating and despising the starving. One way of passing the time between birth and death.

Ideal day for you?

[frankthring]

I raised this topic because I am all in favour of helping developing nations
if we can be assured that the money really gets to the roots of the
problems or can be seen to help the starving. But even British Govts have
started to admit that it is invariably siphoned off by the rich - not multi-
nationals Mr Johnson, but the elite (invariably the dictator and his party
supporters) of these countries. The list is endless.....I even saw in the
Press this morning that the fifth (ie minor) son of Gaddhafi admitted to
spending $2 million a month every month for years on luxuries. Where
does this money come from if not corruption and graft ? Charity begins at
home; when African nations were asked to try and help one another
with this Horn of Africa problem even many of the big ones did nothing but
I am sure their rulers are spending much more than $10,000 a day on
enjoying a bling lifestyle or siphoning off their country`s wealth to a Swiss
bank.....clearly, Mr Johnson, you are willing to turn a blind eye to this
corruption ("poor little African rulers, lets blame the nasty multi-nationals
and old colonial powers" etc). Well, I am not ! They should get their own
affairs in order..,. or show clear intent to do so... Then come asking for
handouts !

[David Johnson]

"if you really want to help david then why dont you pack your bags,get your injections and fly your arse down to Ethiopia for a few weeks. i am sure if you have given so much to charity that if you add it all up according to you then the flight would probably cost less than you have given away.then you can talk about helping others less fortunate."

This is complete and utter nonsense. More Sayitwrong than Sayitreal.

Am I in favour of this country giving foreign aid? Yes I am. I have no problem with my taxes going towards that. Of course I realise that this money isn't always spent properly.

2nfro who has a deep seated hatred, it would appear, of people less well off than himself in other countries, asked me what I did to help. I replied. I realise this is a drop in the ocean, but given the fact that I am just one of millions who donate from the UK, even given the situation in which some aid is badly spent, I believe it makes a difference.

"before you ask i did just that in my gap year at uni instead of handing over cash which would go god knows where put your money where your mouth is and fly down there and HELP!! instead of lining bastards pockets
you game??????????????"

This is childish nonsense.

What Africa does not need is gawky teenagers turning up in Africa to save the world so they can then prattle endlessly about it to their chums over a few pints down the local. Unless you have a specific skill e.g. medicine, engineering, construction, agriculture etc. I suspect the benefits are more for the individual who goes out there than the people who are suffering from famine.

I repeat I am not setting myself up as Mother Theresa. All I am saying is two things:

1. I support the payment of the foreign aid by the UK.
2. If people want to make a contribution that is entirely their affair. That is their prerogative.

As an aside, one of the things a university education has clearly not taught you is that being forthright is not the same as being correct.

As I recall you "Sayitreal" here re. the Tottenham riots and once again, talked completely out of your arse.

http://bgafd.co.uk/forum/read.php?f=3&i=248448&t=248406

I notice you did not have the guts to reply to my email and omit you were talking nonsense yet again.

CHeers
D

[jimslip]

Well said Frank, anyway here's a view on African corruption by the BBC, read the comments at the end as most of them come from Africa itself.

In my view the multinationals merely pour oil on the flames of institutionalised corruption that exists amongst the ruling elites that control Africa. The problem with David Johnson's, hand wringing, "Right on" view on the problem, is that it patronises Africans as almost "Child like". In other words they instantly and unwillingly yield, to the might of the multinational, brutal, capitalists. The Socialist, "Right-on", view is in effect, profoundlyracist, as it refuses to apportion any blame to the Africans themselves, they are depicted as mere help less, simpletons at the hands of villainous capitalists.

This is nonsense, the well educated, African ruling elites WELCOME the multinationals with open arms, to collect their piles of wonga and are oblivious to the suffering of their own people. They simply don't give a toss. David Johnson's "Iron fist, in the velvet glove" Socialism, (with a ton of Political Correctness, thrown in), would have you believe, with a bit of state control, all would be well in Africa. The governing scumbags would come out of their palaces and shake hands with the starving hordes outside and friendship and love would save the day!

African ruling elites are like elites anywhere in the World, greedy corrupt bastards, who'll happily see their own people suffer and die to satisfy their own greed.........George W Bush for example? The West is just a little more subtle about this and leads us to believe that in some way, we the people, have some control over the multinationals, when in fact, we do not!

[David Johnson]

Frank,

"I raised this topic because I am all in favour of helping developing nations
if we can be assured that the money really gets to the roots of the
problems or can be seen to help the starving."

I will translate this for you. "Hey I am really a good guy, but when some of the money gets siphoned off, then I get angry"

The other version of this is "Hey, I am really a good businessmen, I would stop avoiding pay tax or carrying out tax evasion techniques, if the UK government stopped wasting taxpayers' money."

Same old, same old, Frank.

"But even British Govts have started to admit that it is invariably siphoned off by the rich - not multi- nationals Mr Johnson, but the elite (invariably the dictator and his party supporters) of these countries.

This suggest that British governments are stating that foreign aid always ends up with the rich i.e. it's a complete waste of time.

This is wrong. No British government has suggested that it is a waste of time.

" even saw in the
Press this morning that the fifth (ie minor) son of Gaddhafi admitted to
spending $2 million a month every month for years on luxuries. Where
does this money come from if not corruption and graft ?"

This is confused. There are two separate issues.
1. African governments taking money from foreign aid.
2. African governments misappropriating the countries' resources.

I am not stating either is acceptable. In the case of Libya, it clearly has the capability given the low population and huge oil resources to be one of the richest countries in Africa.

"Charity begins at
home;"

I will translate this for you. "Other people can go fuck themselves if they are starving". That is the implication though you do not state it precisely.

"when African nations were asked to try and help one another
with this Horn of Africa problem even many of the big ones did nothing"

I will translate this for you. "If some nation states do not help, we should never help. Makes sense! And if some people starve to death, tough shit"

"clearly, Mr Johnson, you are willing to turn a blind eye to this
corruption ("poor little African rulers, lets blame the nasty multi-nationals
and old colonial powers" etc). "

This is crap. I do not turn a blind eye. If I state anywhere on this forum that this is acceptable, provide a link. Otherwise stop rambling inaccurately.
Clearly every effort needs to be made to ensure aid is spent correctly.

Have a nice day
D