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Bicycle Bum wrote:

> Emac, you'll be HIV tested there-and-then just before the
> action commences. I don't know how reliable these HIV tests are
> but it seems HIV is the only thing they care about.

I feared this was the case, and it proves they're bullshitters. You can't test for HIV that way. Blood is taken and cultured in a lab to see if HIV antibodies appear. This takes days, not hours or minutes, so this 'test' is meaningless. How reckless of anyone to participate!

Not sure if the DIY test is totally worthless but it's clearly less reliable than lab testing.

Some girls are intentionally reckless. There is one girl, a rather hot blonde called Natascha 'The Gangbang Queen' who isn't motivated by money at all. She claims to have an important job with a well known corporation. She hides her identity behind a tasteful mask, except you could use photoshop to reconstruct her image without it. Anyway, she won't let any guy fuck her with a condom. She gets off by being inseminated by lots of anonymous guys, and turns up at porn theatres and dogging locations out of the blue to literally get pumped full of semen. Obviously no testing of any kind here. It's possible this girl has never been infected with anything. She might have an unusual immune system. Who knows, but she should be exposed. I thought about taking the piss by reconstructing her image without the mask then putting it online carrying a public health warning. Anyway, she has performed with Sexi-Susi at bareback events and Sexi-Susi has performed with Salma de nora at bareback events and both have been in the German porn industry.

I always knew that on the spot DIY testing would be a bad thing for the industry. For all we know about it, somebody comes in and takes a jab, takes your money (because its not free) blinds you with some science and simply tells you you havent got HIV like some kind of placebo then you feel your ok

As the song goes...."There may be trouble ahead"....

With 80-90% of the female & male Pro & Am stars escorting where do you draw lines on who is safe & who is not & where they are having their tests...on the spot tests were bad news in the States as like some of these private clinics its all about the money & turn over not the people they see.

Some of these private clinics give a full test on just a blood sample which can't be right as you need swabs & water samples as well, its not just getting people in line its also boycotting clinics that are making money on bad tests.

How do we even hope to regulate an industry with no edges, no rules, no laws & which can't be controlled without a union or a body that everyone agree's with.

For years we tried to gain support for safer sex scenes e.g condoms but were beaten with a stick for even thinking it, we came to the conclusion no one cares because selling the films are far more important than models health...

Most people won't work with anyone who is classed as high risk e.g. recently worked oversea's, doing bareback parties etc, with the recession more people are coming into the industry trying to undercut the regular models by doing bareback & some of our older stars are doing the same to get work.

Most of these have their cards marked like the lady you are talking about in this thread & are simply avoided, if you take away the girls doing parties & the escorts who both have regular test & use condoms we are left with an empty industry with hardly any models.

Who & how do we put people regularly tested into safe & non-safe categories, keeping monthly/bi-monthly lists of the models you have worked & also include if you are escorting or doing parties would be good if everyone done it right & was honest.

A new signed release stating the people in the films have up to dates certs (with copy of certs recorded) & that producers can't be made liable for any STD's that could happen in the making of the film should become norm to protect producers.

I think that's a bit hyperbolic. Biological terrorism? I am not sure that consensual sex is an illegal activity. If people who don't have a verifiable health certificate and have sex are going to be arrested then that looks like a rather large number of people will be arrested. Maybe we should arrest all the parents who haven't given their kids the measles vaccination then?

joe king wrote:

> I think that's a bit hyperbolic. Biological terrorism? I am not
> sure that consensual sex is an illegal activity. If people who
> don't have a verifiable health certificate and have sex are
> going to be arrested then that looks like a rather large number
> of people will be arrested. Maybe we should arrest all the
> parents who haven't given their kids the measles vaccination
> then?
>
>

In many states of the US, it is a major crime (felony) to knowingly have unprotected sex with unsuspecting people if you are HIV positive, and for good reason. If you are organising events which very obviously by their nature put hundreds, or exponentially 10s of thousands of people at risk of a chronic infection such as HIV, why should it not be treated as a major crime?

No one is talks about arresting everyone, *that* is hyperbole. We are talking about dealing with people who willfuly set up and run such high-risk events. It is quick, easy and often free to get a full health test done, so why would everyone not want that assurance they're clean and then indulge in safe practices to protect themselves?

Kim wrote:

A new signed release stating the people in the films have up to dates certs (with copy of certs recorded) & that producers can't be made liable for any STD's that could happen in the making of the film should become norm to protect producers.

A very good point that we discussed at UKAP Kim which is why we have to revise the initial draft protocol to facilitate the fact AITA are no longer around to deal with it like they did the HIV scare.

Recently UKAP were told on twitter by a core group of male performers that they dont need to be told what to do by "five men and a dog" associations like UKAP. Thats reassuring to know. We can drop the ball on that one then and let the models get on with it. Frankly Im bored to tears with it all now given the effort Ive put in with my peers over the years on this topic and quite happy to pass the baton of responsibilty to the model contingent.

This is one of the things we'll spend a few minutes on at the next meeting if any models want to step up on this but I doubt it because very few have expressed interest in this are before

Maybe its high time the models had their own association or union. If they really care about their health. welfare and work conditions. Ive heard the most complaints about producers and companies but models seldom do anything but go back to it and thats how things like these parties flourish without interference.

You can't and shouldn't criminalize against unprotected sex with anonymous persons, and neither should you be legally required to have an HIV test.
Just as there is a difference between serving alcohol in the privacy of your own home and serving it at a public venue, there is a difference between having unprotected sex with someone you just met and organising bareback gangbang events. It is the organizers and venue owners who should be dealt with and in some cases the organizers are the participating girls themselves.
The German authorities simply need to amend the terms of licensing of FKK and partytreff venues stipulating that bareback gangbang events are illegal along with any advertising of such events. This would be one of the biggest blows to organizers within Germany. It should also be made a law that permission needs to be sought before a bareback event can go ahead elsewhere. Naturally the authorities would not grant such permission.

OEJ, the parties would flourish anyway, even if a blacklist were compiled by the porn industry banning for life anyone on it. If a girl had to choose her allegiance she might choose parties over porn, simply because they seem quite lucrative. Money is the biggest deciding factor for some people. Naturally porn producers don't want the authorities to get involved regulating gangbang events since it might impact on their freedoms within the industry. It's precisely these risky events that will cause the authorities sooner or later to clamp down heavily on the whole skin trade.