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Of course it's not, but it is the principle that is important as it has far has wider implicatons for our freedom and the way society is run.

Officer Dibble.

It's no good heckling from the back there spook. If you disagree with anything I've said you should say why. I can then either stick my hand up and plead guilty as charged or I can proceed to disect your argument, with my celebrated scalpel of objective logic, sentence by sentence.

Officer Dibble.

Fair enough.

To describe large sections of society as "ponces" or "twats" is clearly bigoted.

To ignore the fact that women are grossly misrepresented in all senior and managerial positions, whilst suggesting that any women in those positions are not up to the job & are only there due to "political correctness gone mad", is clearly misogynistic.

To suggest that the media is dominated by middle-class, public sector loving liberals is ridiculous. Do you really believe that Lord Rothemere, Richard Desmond, Victor Black, Conrad Black, Rupert Murdoch, Greg Dyke, Michael Green, Charles Allen, etc etc, fall into this category?

objective logic is a subjective concept when applied to matters personal, rather than scientific. only those residing at the extreme polarities of social/political discourse argue otherwise.

?To describe large sections of society as "ponces" or "twats" is clearly bigoted.?


I?ll grant I may be guilty of bigotry in this instance ? I detest those fuckers (the politically correct middle classes) and feel a primeval urge to actually twat one or two of ?em. But my loathing is borne of fear. Fear for my liberty and that of my fellow citizens. Fear of a ?Big Brother? society where only state approved ?appropriate? thoughts are valid or even allowed. Fear of an alien (to me) belief system that is based not on reality, but on the need to make others, and at all costs, feel as though they are as attractive, as clever, as useful as anyone else, even if this is obviously not the case. Political correctness is just a big lie (similarly the ?Newthink? in Orwell?s 1984) that will one day bounce back and bite it?s supporters on the ass.

?To ignore the fact that women are grossly misrepresented in all senior and managerial positions, whilst suggesting that any women in those positions are not up to the job & are only there due to "political correctness gone mad", is clearly misogynistic.?

This is clearly bollocks. Women are not misrepresented at all. In fact in the public sector there will be many more in managerial positions that they would not have attained (and I?m not suggesting lack of ability here) by naturally rising through the ranks. Men and women are two entirely different things. Women have entirely different instincts and a totally different outlook on life than men. Most women are not competitive like men, they do not feel a need to acquire power and position like men - Men need power and position to impress a potential (female) mate. Women have a totally different biological role; nature designed them to primarily seek out the best mates possible (usually the most powerful males in a group) bare the children and to care for them afterwards. And basically that?s it. You don?t usually find women at the head of groups because they have no particular instinct to get there, they have other priorities. However, the politically correct are determined to put them there whether they or anyone else like?s it or not. And ?misogynistic?? How absurd! How does simply recognising the biological and physiological differences between men and women mean that I hate women? I love women, because they are different. Because they are soft, sweet, gentle, manipulative, sexual, and indeed sometimes intoxicating creatures. I love them because they are women, different from men. I wouldn?t love them if they had the same qualities as geezers, now would I?

On to the Media.

?To suggest that the media is dominated by middle-class public sector loving liberals is ridiculous. Do you really believe that Lord Rothemere, Richard Desmond, Victor Black, Conrad Black, Rupert Murdoch, Greg Dyke, Michael Green, Charles Allen, etc etc, fall into this category??

What I meant was that most of middle management and journalists fall into the category of the politically correct middle classes. Yer John Snows and yer John Pilgers always tossing themselves off over the Palestinians and obscure tribesmen is in obscure districts of obscure countries of which we know little of and don?t give a fuck about anyway. Do you think ?Darren? and ?Dave? working on the production line of the Widget factory give the slightest fuck about the Palestinians? Because I can assure you they don?t. But why then, if two thirds of the country doesn?t give a fuck about these issues, are we always hearing about them? Because these kinds off issues are fashionable with the almost exclusively middleclass journalists and program makers who make up the media. Oh, and I take issue with your use of the word ?Liberal? Those public sector wallers are not liberal in my understanding of the word ? They want to use the power of the Sate to make you think and do things that you make not wish to. Maybe ?fascist? would have been more appropriate?

Officer Dibble.

I take your point, but some of the matters at issue here - the biological and psychological differences between men and women for instance, do fall into the scientific category i.e., they ARE different or they ARE NOT. In scientific circles issues like these would be absolute, not a matter of woolly social and political opinion.

Dibble.

All bigotry is borne from fear and ignorance - like all irrational hatreds - yours are no different.

"Because they are soft, sweet, gentle, manipulative, sexual, and indeed sometimes intoxicating creatures" - Well this is clearly misogynistic, are these really the best qualities of women you can think of - that they are warm and fluffy? Try intelligent, creative, brave etc. Your "me hunt mammoth, you stay home and cook" reasoning is not cold logic, just blind prejudice.

"What I meant was that most of middle management and journalists fall into the category of the politically correct middle classes"
- so somehow these highly successful businessmen have been fooled into hiring people they are idealogically opposed to? I'm not sure what John Snow has done to upset you, but Pilger is clearly at one end of the political spectrum, but then commentators such as Janet Daley and Simon Heffer are at the other end. There are a variety of political views available from the British media - your belief that they all tow the "politically correct" line is again borne from irrational prejudice rather than cold logic.

So the working classes have no interest in world affairs - is this argument based on evidence and logic or are we back to assumption and prejudice. Should the whole news agenda be based on the interests of your "Darren and Dave". Seeing as we are heading towards war in the Middle East, is it not a good thing that the media show an interest in the Palestinian issue?

?All bigotry is borne from fear and ignorance - like all irrational hatreds - yours are no different.?

But Spook, it?s not irrational. They really are trying to curtail our freedom and brainwash us into thinking only politically correct ?appropriate? thoughts.

"Because they are soft, sweet, gentle, manipulative, sexual, and indeed sometimes intoxicating creatures" - Well this is clearly misogynistic, are these really the best qualities of women you can think of - that they are warm and fluffy? Try intelligent, creative, brave etc. Your "me hunt mammoth, you stay home and cook" reasoning is not cold logic, just blind prejudice.

?Warm & fluffy?? Well, they?re certainly feminine qualities that appeal to me. I?m attracted to women who embrace their femininity, as I would suggest most guys are. Why would you want someone who was lairy, aggressive, and obnoxious? Most guys have ?pals? and ?mates? to fulfil that role. Of course women can be creative, intelligent and brave. I don?t have a problem with that ? look at Maggie Thatcher, she was the best ?man? on their team. And through many hated her for actually getting things done and sorted, she will go on to be remembered as the second greatest Prime Minister of the 20th Century. She had massive influence on, not only our culture and economic prosperity, but also that of the world. A remarkable woman ? wouldn?t want to take her out on a date though. Something warm and fluffy would be much more agreeable in that instance. And you keep bagging on with that politically correct watch word ?Misogynistic? Do you have a politically correct ?little red book? with all these phrase and terms in? I checked with my Collins and as I suspected ?Misogynistic? means a hatred of women. Well, I don?t know about your politically correct world, but where I come from we call those we hate something entirely different to ?soft, sweet, gentle and intoxicating.?

"What I meant was that most of middle management and journalists fall into the category of the politically correct middle classes"
- so somehow these highly successful businessmen have been fooled into hiring people they are ideologically opposed to? I'm not sure what John Snow has done to upset you, but Pilger is clearly at one end of the political spectrum, but then commentators such as Janet Daley and Simon Heffer are at the other end. There are a variety of political views available from the British media - your belief that they all tow the "politically correct" line is again borne from irrational prejudice rather than cold logic.


Those businessmen haven?t been fooled, it?s just that there are not enough jurnolists about which share their right of centre, conservative, capitalist views and vision, because that?s not (key word coming up) FASIONABLE at the moment. But it is fashionable amongst the young middleclass to be ?right-on? and left of centre. John Snow?s not such a bad chap, I watch him every night ? but I have an overwhelming desire to phone him up in the middle of any evening?s program and say ?John, give it a rest will you old son. I don?t give the slightest fuck about the Palestinians. Who are they? What are they to me? And from what I can see they?ve only got themselves to blame for the Israelis leaning on them ? Hey, if someone throw stones at me and blew my wife and child to bits I?d want to shoot their fuckin? asses up too. Maybe if they tried behaving themselves? So what about taking up some issues here at home, like the encroaching Big Brother society? Or the constant chipping away of out freedom and rights ? jury trails anyone?

Oh, and I can?t stand that Simon Heffer either. What an appalling creep ? he wants to use the power of the state to make us only do things what he likes ? just the same as the lefties. Melanie Phillips is very annoying to, but on occasion I have found myself in agreement.

?So the working classes have no interest in world affairs - is this argument based on evidence and logic or are we back to assumption and prejudice. Should the whole news agenda be based on the interests of your "Darren and Dave". Seeing as we are heading towards war in the Middle East, is it not a good thing that the media show an interest in the Palestinian issue?

No, I don?t need any evidence for this one, as I speak entirely from experience. Yes, I grew up with the Darren?s and the Dave?s of this world and for a while I toiled along side them down at the Widget factory and I can report that almost to a man the only things they were interested in were birds, booze, fast cars and footy. But agreeable that most of these subjects are (I never was a footy fan) I found that my mind needed greater sustenance. So no, I?m not suggesting that every member of the working classes has no interest in anything other than their immediate universe (work, pub, football ground) that is not the case. It?s just that the majority have no interest or comprehension of anything other than the immediate and the mundane. Didn?t Orwell say something about the proletariat being so wrapped up in the drudgery of their daily lives that they had no time for anything else?

Officer Dibble.

To end this pointless argument from my point of view I am satisfied that you are a bigot - you think the middle classes are twats, the working classes and young people are stupid and you don't give a fuck about events outside the UK

You are a misogynist because you see women as objects - some bizarre combination of kitten, kitchen appliance and blow-up doll.

Your conspiracy theories about politically correct thought police and blatant media bias make David Icke look like a beacon of logic and clear-thinking.

For gods sake man

Just as there are always two sides to any debate due to differing perspectives

There is no right or wrong answer a subjective matter

Just agree to disagree

Leave the name calling in the cupboard

cheers
B...OZ

PS Watched any good porn lately?
Saw Two Buckingham Palace Guards get rogered silly just recently
Pity it wasn't a British film