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>I'm sorry Robches, but I never got around to reading the IPCC report.

That's clear, as you kept on spouting the disinformation which Scotland Yard was putting out in the aftermath of the shooting.

>It doesn't matter anyway, as my original point was that we shouldn't be pissed off at the policeman/woman who shot the suspect

It does matter, a completely innocent man was shot dead by the police. If you think that does not matter then your complacency is staggering.

I agree that the armed police should not be blamed if they were given the Kratos code word. In that case, they had a duty to shoot him, because their Gold Commander was telling them he was a suicide bomber. But Cmdr Dick is saying she told them to "stop" him entering Stockwell Station, she did not give the Kratos code word.

So we need to know what happened. Was he actually id'ed by the surveillance team? Did Dick issue the Kratos command? If not, why did the armed police shoot him?

We cannot have the police shooting people dead, and then saying, in effect, "sorry, it was an accident." That just won't do. That is the power of life and death, without any responsibility. To me, that's unacceptable. You seem fine with it, so you are obviously a trusting sort. Since our ruling class seems to consist of corrupt timeservers, I can't think why you are so trusting, but I suppose that's your problem.

You know what? We have the same problem here in the states with people. They just accept that things are the way they are and that's the very reason we're in a police state of society. They'll shoot an unarmed man (black) and then say "well he probably had a criminal record" or a mentally challenged man (white) and say "he was a danger to himself". We don't just have to accept it and go on y'all! Ask questions about what's going on here and don't be scared to. THAT'S THE PROBLEM! Ya too damn scared and if a cop beats you with a billy club, you'll say "well I deserved it! I shouldn't have ran that stop sign"! Crazy ain't it!

Luckily we don't get 'beat over the head' for traffic offences over here, regardless over your colour. I've been to the USA and I find it's definately more 'accepted' to be racist over there than over here. I found it really uncomfortable.....

[quote]I agree that the armed police should not be blamed if they were given the Kratos code word. In that case, they had a duty to shoot him, because their Gold Commander was telling them he was a suicide bomber. But Cmdr Dick is saying she told them to "stop" him entering Stockwell Station, she did not give the Kratos code word.[/quote]

I'm guessing the police are also allowed to take action upon their instincts & circumstance, regardless of stupid code words. Code words are ok if you're sniping from 300 metres away, but if you're underground with a suspected bomber -with innocent civilians walking by- then you can't tell the suspect to 'hold on' while you radio through for the code word! Jesus........ *rolls eyes*

[quote]We cannot have the police shooting people dead, and then saying, in effect, "sorry, it was an accident." That just won't do. That is the power of life and death, without any responsibility. To me, that's unacceptable.[/quote]

I've said this further up the thread. "I'll take accidental shootings from the police, over someone blowing people up." It's common sense. I'm sorry you seem more concerned about police incidents, than suicide bombers.

[quote]You seem fine with it, so you are obviously a trusting sort. Since our ruling class seems to consist of corrupt timeservers, I can't think why you are so trusting, but I suppose that's your problem.[/quote]

Nah.......I wouldn't say I'm 'fine' with it. I'd just rather accept a hard line stance from our police, if that stance helps deter a massacre (or two). Lets just say it's the 'lesser' of the two evils......mmmmmmmkay?

I can imagine your ideal world where there are no suicide bombers & everyone's hugging & kissing eachother, but suicide bombers don't walk onto the fucking 'Trisha Show' to have a nice chat about their 'mental state' & 'urges to kill' do they?

Terrorism 'just isnt cricket' Robches. Nobody wants to play fair & I'm proud our policeforce sent out the message 'don't fuck with us' for once.

Yeah........I'll agree 'it was a fuck up'. I've no arguement with that. It's a 'fuck up' I'm willing to accept though.

I want every 'would be' suicide bomber to think that they're not going to achieve their objective. I want them to think they'll be shot dead before they get a chance to detonate any bomb they may be carrying. I want them to think 'fuck it, lets do this somewhere else! It's too hard to bomb people here in the UK!'

I want my girlfriend to get from Oxford Circus to Mile End, tomorrow morning without being blown to tiny little pieces.

If the UK becomes the easiest place to bomb civilians, then we'll become the first, and most popular target on earth for them to make their statements. I'm not blind to the fact that police guidelines can overstep the mark, and that there should be limits on power, but in my opinion they haven't overstepped anything & hopefully 'fuck ups' are kept to a minimum.

People all across the world have been known to 'fuck up' from time to time. Even 'well programmed' software, and the latest, most technological 'hardware' fucks up frequently. Human error is something we cannot eradicate at the present time, so we'll have to make do.........

Ya THINK I like it?! Believe me, I've met a lot of white people over the years and they were great, but if some were racist, either they did a good job of hiding it or some way they'll let you know they are by their stupidity. No we literaly (the cops) don't beat nobody over the head because of a traffic stop. Oh wait! Remeber Rodney King?

You still don't get it Sam.
The fear of getting shot just doesn't enter into it. If you are carrying explosives as a suicide bomber are you going to be afraid of getting shot?
Like some of those Kamikazi pilots said "Fuck this, I'm not going to do it. I might get shot down".

Mart

mart wrote:

>>


No - they WANT to die. But the whole point is that they want to take as many innocents as possible with them when they go - NOT get shot before they've even had a chance to detonate their bomb.

Yes, mistakes need to be looked into and prevented as much as is humanly possible. And obviously rules and procedures are needed.

But if the Police become TOO bogged down in rules and procedures through fear of being prosecuted every time a mistake is made, then it eventually becomes impossible for them to do their jobs effectively - a state of affairs of which the terroist will quickly become all to awaare, and that will only mean MORE successful suicide bombings and innocents dying on a massive scale.

While we're wringing our hands and belating about the "rules", we should also remember that the terrorists don't play by ANY "rules" of normal civilised society.

Who said he was a terrorist BEFORE he got shot? Certainly don't look that way now!