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on one of the news broadcasts, there was an item in which an employers group were bemoaning a 'skills shortage' for their crap jobs.

ie people with not the levels of skills applying.

from my experience of looking for a new job, is that what employer's want bears no relationship to the low [ in most cases very low] wage they expect to get away with.

there are probably the people with the skills, but they don't want to work for the crap wage that's on offer.

its getting even worse now that graduates and being dumped with thousands of pounds of debt, and employers don't seem to be increasing wages to compensate them.

i've seen adverts saying 'good wage' and its 10 - 20p above minimum wage. must be a good wage from their side of the coin.

to me a good wage has to be by definition higher than the national average wage/

What IS the national average wage? I've never heard of what it could be approx.

I dont even wanna think about income and wages as Im starting uni in Sept and the futures going to be a bit black for a bit financially...as for getting jobs, well Ive given up wondering what employers want as im clearly the king of not getting jobs.........................................

Sounds a bit like trying to scrape a living out of this business.

Learn a trade, these days it,s the only way to go, as a plumber/electrician/joiner/builder etc you will never be out of work, and will earn considerably more than a graduate, who by definition will now be in debt for a good few years as well as struggling to find a job.

Well I might be doing an architecture degree...theres gotta be a fair amount of options with one of those I wouldve thought :S

I hope for you there is ID, but a trade g,ntees you a permanant job especially if you have your own business, you will have the ability to control the amount you earn, and when you work, I have never met a builder who was without work, certainly in the last 10 years, fuck knows they have had enough money off me to retire on.

Yeh I know what you're saying Liz in fact im a very knowledge thirsty and in the next couple of years I plan on doing some 18 week courses on car diagnosis, electrical, maybe plumbing etc things like that so I can be more self-sufficient when im older and wont have to pay like ?120 for a job I could diagnose myself and get the part for ?6 from a DIY Store....

and of course I always have er...music to fall back on

.......depends on whether it's a proper degree, or a Mickey Mouse one (e.g. 'media studies'). If it's in science/law/medicine etc, tough shit about the loan- you'll be able to pay it back in about 2 years flat, then out-earn the rest of us till you retire at 45, so stop moaning*. And it doesn't bode well for the future of medicine that that silly little girl should cop the line that 'I'll be glad I paid for her degree when she saves my life'. Um, no: not really- if you don't like the set-up, piss off and we'll fill your place at Med School with someone who really wants to be there, whose education, like yours, I've already I've paid for three hundred times over.
Labour's policy is idiocy- a degree is completely devalued where the majority of the population have one, however intrinsically valueless, and lowering the bar in the name of inclusiveness defeats the whole object of the exercise. And employers will know which are worth the vellum they're written on, anyway.
Why is 'failure' such a dirty word to Labour? They must be pretty well-acquainted with it by now........
*And even badly-paid graduates, of whom there are many, still have fantastic life-advantages compared with the 'undegreed'.

Science! possibly, Law! definitely, Medicine, well there are 3000 unfilled GP jobs going right now!, and junior doctors resigning everyday, so not too sure about that, a media degree dont mean shit!,, It,s who you know....trust me on that one, the most you could hope for with a Law degree after 2 years is probably a legal exec, or trainee solicitor/junior partner, so with a 12k loan it still takes some paying back.
I stick to my point...........be a Plumber/Builder/Electrician pref self employed if you want to out earn as well as rip off the above degree holders.
There is another exception....Dentistry- all private now, unless you are already registered, but I wouldn,t fancy doing that for a living, I,m happy being a chimney sweep guv!

I agree with you all on the mickey mouse degrees, most of my friends have been suckered into the whole art or media studies degrees which are really pointless because like you say if you want to work in that field you need to know someone or be prepared to work your way up from the bottom...although I maintain most people who aspire to that are doing it for lifestyle choice (not that I can talk considering the way my preferred careers would appear to others).

Dont forget when you are young and going to uni, the world is your oyster and choosing something to do doesnt have to be soley based on how much money you can get out of the job at the end or how easy it will be to get into. One forumite (prob Ace) said a while back that education is seen as being the key to more money and it shouldnt be like that - made me think a lot

Liz - going to uni is going to be half about a social and personal er "journey" not just about jobs/careers