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This question is directed at those who have submitted videos for R18 certification and other knowledgeable beings such as Alec and JJ.

For an upcoming shoot I want to do some outdoors stuff. There will be two aspects to it - one will be some teasy type stuff in the streets, supermarket car parks, in the car etc and the other will be a full on orgy in a private and secluded garden.

On the BBFC site they dont specifically state that they have a problem with outdoor sex but it does say that "any material which is in breach of the criminal law" is not acceptable. Also in the decisions listings there are a number of videos which have been cut due to "public indecency".

Where is the line with outdoor stuff? If I was to film a girl playing with herself in the back of my car in a secluded part of Sainsburys car park would that be cut? I assume there is no problem with an outdoors group scene as long as it is private and secluded?

Your assistance is appreciated.

Jason

don't do it

Can you elaborate on that Joe? Don't do what?

Don't do the supermarket bit, the garden bit, don't bother with R18 certification, all of the above?????

'If I was to film a girl playing with herself in the back of my car in a secluded part of Sainsburys car park would that be cut?'

'BEN DOVER - CUMMING OF AGE VOLUME 2
. Cut required to sex in public places for "R18" on the grounds of public indecency '
'BRITISH HOME VIDEO NR 1
Cuts required to abusive 'schoolgirl' scenario and sexualised images of a women exposing her genitals and a woman urinating, both in public, in the UK, to obtain an 'R18' in accordance (respectively) with BBFC guidelines and UK public indecency laws'

'MORE CASTINGS Cuts required to sequences that are in breach of UK legislation on public indecency/indecent exposure where sexual activity is taking place in public areas in the UK. The company was invited to supply assurances that the sequences in question were not filmed in the UK '

'PRIVATE CASTINGS 19 . Cut required to sight of sexual activity in public place for which assurances that such detail could not have infringed UK indecency laws could not be obtained'
Ben Dover had to cut 1 where he had sex on a train - he couldn't prove there were onlookers.

Thanks Joe, thats pretty much what I thought about the car and Sainsburys etc (unfortunately).

What about shooting in a private garden in the middle of nowhere where no one can see you? I am convinced I have seen outdoor sex in an R18 video but can't be 100% sure.

Might shoot it all anyway and then just not put the outdoor stuff into the R18 versions but put it into any going to European or American distributors

Cheers

Jason

Secret Garden Sex has an orgy in a private garden. Got the R18 version from my local sex shop.

thanks Macks!!

Jason,

I suspect seclusion combined with private land is the key.
I can think of a number of outside scenes that have been
passed in R18 under the new guidelines:

+ Cathy Barry's Secret Garden Sex
+ Deep Desires
+ Sex Outdoors (a version of DB003)

etc. etc. etc.

To answer the specifics of your question I wouldn't have
thought your garden orgy would present a problem, but
flashing in the street almost certainly would be cut.

The supermarket car-park would be a more interesting
example... because it is private property. An acid
test of "Is it possible a policeman would walk by
and if so would he nick me ?" may help in the absence
of sounder legal advice and I reckon you would be
on shaky grounds there.

Sound legal advice anyone ?

Sound legal advice? No such thing. Lawyers are fallible like the rest of the human race. I avoided this thread earlier as I thought the answer was obvious. Even if you live out in the sticks and dont want to bother Rowley Berkin QC with your questions then there are still public libraries with such enlightening publications as Stones Justices Manual (retails at ?200) which is a six part book detailing the law of this green and pleasant land. It includes the VRA 1984 and the OPA which should be read by those who constantly ask what is legal or not....However you will not find a definition of obscenity in any book as that is something that changes all the time-thankfully.

Magoo rambled a bit there. But to answer the original question. Sex or indecent exposure in a public place is illegal even in your own back garden if it is possible for it to be seen by another person. As with nearly all criminal offences the test of "the reasonable man" applies. So if you have a location that cant be overlooked (and a Court would accept that a reasonable man could not be expected to forsee such an event being seen by a third party then your in the clear).
Am I getting paid for this? No? In short either film on private property that is not visible to the public or film abroad. Of course filming abroad would mean paying the ferry ticket and its obvious you dont like paying otherwise you would have gone to a solicitor instead of scrounging info from me. I better get a few free tapes off you for this you tight fisted git Jason.

And as an aside Jason. I am sure that the likes of myself, Joe King, Woodgnome etc etc are not too upset at you mentioning only Alec and JJ as knowlegble in your post.

As an afterthought why dont you save yourself the hassle and the expense and just market your films uncertificated. The distributers are here on this forum and it means you can include outdoor/public and pissing etc and avoid the extortionate bbfc fees. The police could not give a fuck about it these days.