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I remember hearing one of Alistair Cooke's 'Letter from America' radio segments where he discussed the way terms regarded as racist have changed over the years.

He gave the example from about 40 or more years ago where, in a heated public forum someone used the term 'blacks'. The audience drew in their breaths in shock before he quickly corrected himself with 'Negros'. The context where the terms were used were quite neutral, simply the term 'black' was at that time offensive.

These days of course the term black is acceptable while negro is wrong. This confuses me because surely black can only refer the the colour of one's skin, while negro refers to your race - as does Caucasian for 'white' but this never seems to cause offence. When I've asked why this is, I of course get told I'm a racist but I never get an explanation.

Here in Oz, in the past few years the term 'aboriginal' is being replaced with 'indigenous' by the sort of people often seen at art gallery openings and Green political conventions. When I look in the dictionary I find that the term indigenous is more often applied to plants and animals than people, while aboriginal more usually refers to people. Again, I can't get an explanation from the PC brigade for this apparent counter-intuitive practice.

The fight against true racism seems to have been hijacked by a bunch of amateur coppers with an urgent need to lecture people like some priggish spoiled teacher's pet.

It's a shame that genuine racism flourishes away secretly behind a facade of correct terms and symbolism.

Try using the description 'indigenous' in the UK to refer to our population and you?d get accused of being racist ? the PC Brigade take the word as a euphemism for white. It is true that a lot of people referring to the indigenous population of the UK do mean the whites, but what?s wrong with that, if that?s what you want to do? The PC Brigade will trot out the usual rubbish ? ?all our ancestors were from somewhere else?, ?blacks and Asians born here are as British as the next man? ? which nobody disputes. But then they extrapolate from the use of the word to a position where they accuse you of being a closet Nazi and probably supported Hitler and the gas chambers .... etc. etc. It all gets pretty pathetic. The main trouble is it?s the arty-farty, middle class whites (New Labour & Liberal Luvvies) who are the ones getting upset on behalf of others.

JonnyHungwell wrote:

>(snip)The PC Brigade will trot out the usual
> rubbish ? ?all our ancestors were from somewhere else?, ?blacks
> and Asians born here are as British as the next man? ? which
> nobody disputes.(snip)

An interesting point, because in Australia the original inhabitants are entitled to land rights and many benefits unavailable to we wicked white invaders. I was born here as were my parents and grandparents, yet I'm not entitled to mining royalties and charging tourists a fee for visiting 'my land'.

Interestingly, many aboriginal people dont want anything to do with all this stuff about "I'm black. You're white. You stole my land 200 years ago so you're still guilty." Its actually lawyers and budding left-wing politicians wanting to make a name for themselves driving it.

Huge amounts of money intended for aboriginal welfare have disappeared without the most needy ever seeing it. There's money to be made in 'combating racism'.

>These days of course the term black is acceptable while negro is wrong.

It is strange, but here in the UK we are told it is "bad" to label someone based on the colour of their skin.

Yet many organisations and events have sprung up that do precisely that.

So within the police force is the "Black officers association".

And we have the MOBO (Music of Black Origin) awards.

And there is the Black Gospel Choir.

And every year we have the "Black history month" were books and plays by black authors are promoted.

When I mentioned to the lady in my local library that "Black History Month" was racist she could not seem to understand. I bet if someone suggested "White History Month" there would be an outrage.

It is all part of the whole "PC" mess we are in at the moment where you cant even crack a joke anymore because it will probably offend someone.

In a recent thread I was called ignorant and racist because I called a black man coloured yet in another thread I spoke about Muslims spitting at my feet.I can't remember anybody calling the Muslims ignorant or racist. Is it because it's assumed the Muslims were uneducated and didn't know any better or as I suspect people are afraid to condemn them in case they too get called the R word ?

Here's an answer I gave to another thread on here - it may be of some use.

"I have to say that I'm bemused by this as riding alongside the statements to the opposite there does seem to be some underlying prejudices here and I'll explain.
Dick's old boss seems to have taken a dislike to him (for whatever reason) and it appears that as a result all people with brown skin are lumped into one race-card-playing and rather easily offended group.
I am not offended by being described as coloured... merely amused. To me it is not offensive it is simply very out-dated. Those using this silly epithet are no different to others who used to carry on saying gramophone instead of stereo. I mean I bet Dick doesn't call his emails - LETTERS or call is computer a WORD PROCESSOR. I wonder if he calls emulsion paint DISTEMPER or say "Confound it" in place of "Fuck it"???

It is interesting to observe which words a person will cling to in the face of changing vogues and fashion whilst readily absorbing many new replacements for other things. A person can give as much 'body-language' away in text as in person-to-person transactions and all our entries are resplendent with 'colourful' (as well as subtle) language that allows others to read between the lines.

So to sum up - If I happily discard 'Coloured' in favour of 'Black' as the current acceptable term for a particular demographic yet insist on keeping the word Cripple when I am fully conversant with the agreed alternative and cite my right to use "whatever words I damn-well PLEASE"... then this surely gives my game away.
I am PLEASED to avoid offence or insult to Black people but I am PLEASED to ignore the wishes of Cripples.

So I USED to be referred to as Coloured but it's not what I would to be called - and never was - so can I politely ask you not to use the term in the same way that you (hopefully) no longer use the word Nigger. (A word that everyone used whilst I was growing up)

One last point that you might like to consider. COLOURED was the term GIVEN to poor ignorant NIGGERS when my ancestors were grudgingly released from of slavery into years of ignominy.
BLACK is the name we TOOK when we finally decided we'd had enough of all this condescending crap."

I would add, Deano, that Negro does not denote race, colour or anything else for that matter. There is no place called Negronia or anything like that at all.
I never quite understood the necessity to call white people Caucasian either but having ome from the security services I find that 'official' terms are more and more being accepted as the norm for everyday life - I cannot think why!?

Lastly (and again quoting the other thread)...

"Hey, no probs mate.
I'm a Yorkshireman and call a spade a spade (no jokes please - lol) I rarely take offense unless offense is actually meant.
Didn't actually realize that you didn't know any Black people as this can be a real issue for anyone wishing to keep up with what to say etc. This, of course, is the same for any demographic and a person can slip up whenever they meet a person from a 'new' social grouping.
Anyway, check out this link and have a good laugh - I know I did.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U_FouF7jQQU
And just in case there's any difficulty in future I'll let you in on the intricasies of my heritage.
My Father was from Dominica (French West Indies - not Dominican Republic).
My Mother was from Cork (?ire).
I have a French Grandfather and 'original' South American (not Latin American) ancestry too.
I was adopted quite young and brought up by a white family in Yorkshire.
I'm still trying to work out what the feck I am supposed to be - beyond ugly!"

And my uncle lives in Adelaide and was a director of QANTAS - just to let you know that I'm conversant with Antipodean issues first-hand too.
(I love Oz. it's like Yorkshire - just a bit bigger!)

Forgot to stress that the PC brigade can fuck off as far as I'm concerned.
They are simply weak people who want to bully someone with the help of the state. So they can wield a big stick even though they are bloody nobodies!
They do not speak for me and I'll tell you why.

If you are a PC twat - where were you and your principles 30 years ago when racism in England was rife?
Where were you and your principles 30 years ago when I was regularly kicked, beaten and spat at on the fucking streets?
If you weren't there when I actually needed a friend you can fuck right off now!

And by the way - for those that care to know why... the word NIGGER is used by black people now for one very good reason... Nobody stopped those mindless bullies handing us that word on a daily basis so it belongs to us now.
Try taking me to court for using it... who the hell do you think my character witnesses will be?
Allow me to be offended for myself - you PC lot are causing division not healing it. I propose a new name for the PC brigade - NAZIS.

UglyDaz wrote:

> Forgot to stress that the PC brigade can fuck off as far as I'm
> concerned.
> They are simply weak people who want to bully someone with the
> help of the state. So they can wield a big stick even though
> they are bloody nobodies!
(snip)

Yes, I think that's what I mean. It bothers me that people can smugly use the correct terms and pull the right facial expressions when they hear a naughty racist term, yet treat various races like morons by being patronising and condescending towards them. By these actions, they show their true feelings. Their symbolic anti-racist stance is what grates on me, along with the whole popular media bullshit that supports their pretense.

You've made some good points in this and the other thread, UglyDaz. However, I think you've missed the whole point about political correctness. It's just about etiquette, that's all. No one's forced to comply, just asked to, in the name of politeness and thoughtfulness.

You can't have a go at people wanting to be politically correct now just because they weren't around 30 years ago to help you ? they were probably 10 years old, or younger.

Like I said on a previous thread: it should be seen as being polite; think of it as common courtesy. I agree that political correctness can sometimes go too far and gave -what I thought was- a good example when it comes to people with disabilities.

PC way: Disabled people.

Un-PC way: The disabled.

For me the above is nit-picking, but, if you want to be polite you sometimes have to do and comply with things against your inclinations and wishes. Another example of political correctness going too far is the following:

I have no disabilities whatsoever but when in the company of disabled people I cannot refer to myself and other people with no disabilities as 'able-bodied' like you could do 10 years ago. I have to refer to myself as 'non-disabled'. In this instance it really has gone too far because it's not somebody asking me to refer to them in a specific way anymore, they're now asking me to refer to myself in a way that pleases them. This is impolite on their part.

But, do you know what irks me about people complaining over what words they can and can't use anymore? It's when they say things like, "You can't go through life without offending anyone." and "I'm not changing the way I speak just to please some minority or self-elected authority!"

These are usually the same people who say, "Our way of life is being eroded away by immigration," and, "Britain was better when I was a lad!" ect, ect. What they don't see is that traditionally the British were famed for their politeness! So, if they want to be so fucking 'traditional' and nationalistic about things then they should be as polite and thoughtful as they possibly can.

The main reason why polite people are so amiable and adhered is that they are people who will give in to their own inclinations and wishes so as not to cause offence or embarrassment to other people in their company. If you're going on a date with a nice girl and want to fart in the restaurant you don't just let it out and think "fuck it, I can't go through life not offending anyone, can I?" and let one off. If you're sat on the bus/tube/train, across from a family and some kids, have itchy bollocks and want to scratch them, you don't just go right ahead and tell the family to "like it or fucking lump it!" On both occasions you refrain until a better time. In fact, holding in your wind, or not scratching an itch puts you out more than not saying a particular word in someone's company. Refraining from scratching your bollocks on a hot day can be torture! !happy!

I can't see why someone will happily do some things to be polite (like letting an old lady on the bus first when it's raining, despite her being behind you in the queue) and yet get outraged when asked to use a different word when in the presence of someone who would appreciate it.

Political correctness can go too far, as I think I've shown with the above examples, but there's no 'brigade' and no 'nazis' going round forcing people at gun point. They're just asking you to be thoughtful, polite and courteous. If the right wing mob think the British way is best then take a leaf out of the old British etiquette pamphlet: brush up on your manners and be a bit more considerate and gracious.