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Re: Causing Offence
Posted: Fri Oct 16, 2009 9:42 pm
by Dick Moby
I think you can only cause offence if you say things with malice. A Chinese restaurant will always be a "chinky" to me simply because it's what I've always called it. At college I was called Jock, a Welshman was called Taffy and an Irishman was called Paddy or Mick and the Australian was Bruce. Back then no offence was meant, or taken.
Re: Causing Offence
Posted: Fri Oct 16, 2009 9:51 pm
by Jonone
What were their female counterparts called, or did you only move in male circles ?
Re: Causing Offence
Posted: Fri Oct 16, 2009 11:21 pm
by Sam Slater
You are well within your rights to not be offended by being called a jock, and some Pakistanis might well ask all their friends to call them 'Paki'. The point is, though, that you're supposed to be polite and thoughtful enough to realise that it's not nice to the majority.
Is it ok to call your wife/sister/mother a whore just because some women might get a kick out of it?
I don't think many sensible people think saying something like, "I'm popping to the chinkies..." would mean that person is a racist; being racist is more than thoughtless language. But when critics come back with, "Don't say that, it's racist." they're pointing out that the language is racist, not you. They're pointing out that continuing to use such language means you don't care too much about offending somebody; you're impolite; you're thoughtless and arrogant. At the other end of the scale you could also be using that language because you get enjoyment from offending someone you might have prejudices against. You could be a racist. You must realise this and also comprehend that one of the biggest ways of fighting racism is to first make it frowned upon to use racist humour and language. You yourself might not be racist but in continuing to use racist nicknames and jokes you aid real racists to disguise their hatred and bile under the same cloak.
Think of it using the following analogy: In Spain it is legal for a man to torture a bull to death. Despite 99% of Spaniards never ever torturing bulls to death their tolerance of the tradition by going to bull fights makes it easier for sadistic idiots to keep on torturing bulls. If all Spaniards as a nation stood against bull-fighting then the sadistic minority would be forced to find it harder to make a living from their barbaric acts. Of course, like racists, there will always be people who like torturing animals, but the good thing is that they're ostracised from polite society which means that they might not be overly keen to pass their sick beliefs on to their sons and daughters. The popularity slowly dwindles to almost nothing ? a little like comparing mothers who'd consider taking their kids to a public hanging in modern day Britain compared to 400 years ago.
If we make it harder for people to get away with racist remarks and humour we make it more difficult for real racism to carry on from generation to generation. So it's a pain in the arse that you can't use the same language that was common-place 30 years ago? You're contributing to something positive in society and surely that's a good thing.
Re: Causing Offence
Posted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 2:44 am
by Dylan Devere
Personally I'm from Liverpool and I'm ok with being called Scouse. . . . .been called alot worse.
I take offence at "there's a scouser around, watch your bag" but I don't feel the need to call the papers about it
Re: Causing Offence
Posted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 7:20 am
by dynatech
"Paki's" have always been called paki's for 40/50 years in this country, but if you refer to someone as "looking like a paki" it is apparantly the worst insult in the world. Even if they are or they do.
Re: Causing Offence
Posted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 7:28 am
by Dick Moby
The blokes on my course were from all over the UK, there were a couple from Australia and one from the Seychelles but the girls at the college were local so we tried to use their names. Simple really.
Re: Causing Offence
Posted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 10:16 am
by Deano!
I'm with Porn Historian on this.
It seems some people don't know they've been offended until some lawyer shows them a list of things deemed offensive. At the same time many of us are offended every day by many things - yet we take the punch and carry on. The end result of trying to legislate to make everyone love each other is nothing but tension and resentment... and rich lawyers.
Anyway, I think the tide is turning against all this crap. I hope in 50 years time people will look back on this in amazement.