egafd.com

I do believe that all countries have signed-up to it now and the thing will proceed. This is one of the most undemocratic things I can think of, countries giving away more of their powers to Europe and having less left for themselves. The people of Ireland said no, which is not what was wanted, so they were asked again and that time they said yes. We were promised a vote on it by Tony Blair who promised to be in office from 2005-2010, and the people elected him with those things in mind. He, of course, went after two years, and one of the most egotistical, power-mad, self-centred individuals ever (Brown) just takes over.

We are now going much further into Europe, against the wishes of the people, but the people's wishes are not taken into account - being taken there by this guy who now runs our country, who no one wanted to be there. We were promised in the 1970's that closer-ties with Europe were really all about trade, not what would eventually become a kind of United States of Europe. Other than the fact you can complain about politicans, and write negative things about them, without being arrested, I would say we have no democracy what so ever in this country anymore. What are other people's views?

The politicians keep chanting the mantra "there will be no superstate", but we all know that's complete bollocks.

OF COURSE there'll be a superstate. That was the aim all along. That's why we are where we are now, the old loose trading confederation of the "Common Market" that we joined in 1973 having long since been replaced by the overtly political, federalist European Union.

Indeed, the progressive changes of name over the years have reflected this growing political nature: It went from being the "European Economic Community" to the "European Community" and then the "European Union".

Eventually it'll be the "United States of Europe" or the "United Federal States of Europe" - something along those lines. National parliaments will be reduced to being little more than regional assemblies, having only very limited powers to deal with relatively trifling, mundane matters - like setting speed limits, building new car parks and appointing dog-catchers. That kind of thing.

What really irks me is that all along, the people of Europe have for the most part been denied any meaningful say in any of this - and on the few occasions when individual countries have been granted referendums, they've almost always said "No" and have then been made to vote again until they delivered the "right" result that the EU wanted.

Sure, we're allowed to vote for the European Parliament. But that's just a cosmetic establishment to give the whole shabby system a veneer of democracy, and only really benefits the MEPs who get to ride a gravy train that makes the one at Westminster look like a kids' fairground ride.

The real power lies with the unelected EU Commissioners and other assorted big-wigs, who are basically all mates together who look after each other's interests.

The whole thing stinks.

I'm all for a European trading block of independent nations. But very much against the monolithic EU dictatorship that's looming on the horizon.

But history goes in circles. Like all empires, it'll eventually grow too big, and conflicting interests will tear it apart. Though that probably won't happen in any of our lifetimes.

- Eric

I notice Cameron has renaged on his 'cast iron guarantee' to give the British people a vote.

What a surprise.

Peter wrote:

>>

That 'guarantee' was always conditional on the Lisbon Treaty NOT having been ratified by the time he gets into office next spring (which seems the most likely outcome in the forthcoming general election).

But since it was always odds-on that the thing *would* be ratified by Christmas, that guarantee was never worth anything - and he knew it.

It was simply tactic to allow him to appear "right on" with public opinion by saying "I absolutely guarantee to hold a referendum if ...". But the events of today have let him off the hook, enabling him to now turn round and say "we've been overtaken by events, so we'll have to have a rethink".

So best of both worlds for Camera-On.

- Eric

!cool!

What does anyone expect from fucking politicians?
They are ALL lying two faced up their own arses in it for themselves and fuck you who voted for me.
The arch lying bastard Ted Heath took this country into a Common Market which was what the referendum for it was all about, and what I voted for.
Not long before the lying sour faced sulky bastard died he was asked about the EU now and the Common Market then and he said bare faced "Oh yes, it was always going to be"
We need a strong UKIP representation so that the lying bastard Cameron, let's not forget this millionaire bastard is in this game for power, not for the financial rewards or the reward of representing people. The only one this bastard is going to represent is himfuckingself, as they all do.

Interesting comments there. I do genuinely fear for the future. A generation from now each European country will just be a province, a kind of county (no 'r' in that word) and the 'capital' will be Brussels or Strausberg. Little kids being born now will be living in a very differnt environment to the one we currently live in by the time they are 30 or 40. I think Europe will be pretty much 50% islamic by then aswell - France will be majority muslim within 30 years if current birth projections are accurate - and to cast a vote in your own country by then will be the equivilant of currently voting in a local council election as all the power will be elsewhere.

This is pure speculation, NOT prediction. We can all speculate and others may have a speculation which is the opposite of your own. If you think your projections are reliable on the macro level why don't you try the micro level of football results and horse racing etc ?

Take a step back, a deep breath, and relax .... or do you prefer anxiety and angst ?