China to execute British man

[one eyed jack]

Thanks for taking the time to explain this coherently to me David, it is much appreciated. You seem to have a better understanding of this topic than I do.

I still feel whtehr mental illness or not that if someone makes a conscious decision to go ahead with doing something bad that this doesnt get them off the hook lightly where thet government is concerned.

I do not condone drug trafficking but all those who have been caught doing it should have known better.

[David Johnson]

"Seeing as you know so much about it I presume you are bi ploar.

So what. "

So..... if you are going to rabbit on about Stephen Fry and bipolar, it would be helpful, if you had a clue what you were talking about and make the effort to understand that there are different levels of severity in illnesses and you cant assume that two people who have the same illness act/feel exactly the same way.

"China has the right to conduct its affairs whether the pair of twatts Broon and Cameron disagree.
They have a penal code with penalties for various offences. This offence carries the death penalty. He offended, he paid. Fucking live with it."

This has nothing whatsoever to do with my argument. My argument is as follows:
1. The Chinese legal system allows mental illness to be taken into account in regard to sentencing.
2. The Chinese refused a mental health assessment to take place.
3. There is a wealth of statements to show that this man was severely delusional and suffering debilitating mental illness. See the link in my post with the subject, OEJ -extra info if you can be arsed to read it.
4. The Chinese have the right to conduct its affairs but just as in this country there can be travesties of justice.
5. I think this is one of them.

"As for a British man being executed, well, I am English. My good friend is Scottish and another good friend is an Ulsterman. Collectively we are British.
The fucking drug smuggler aint."

He was British. He had a brown skin. I realise that being British and having a brown skin probably irritates the hell out of you. You mightn't have noticed but there are lots of people who are British and don't happen to be white. To use your phrase "Fucking live with it".

David

[one eyed jack]

Must admit I am disappointed in the outcome but its not as if I never saw it coming.

As I said the Chinese are not noted for their tolerance. Anyone who knows a bit of their history can see that.

The chinese will not be told by anyone outside of themselves what to do and I did say this.

[David Johnson]

Hiya
Thanks for your comments.

"I still feel whtehr mental illness or not that if someone makes a conscious decision to go ahead with doing something bad that this doesnt get them off the hook lightly where thet government is concerned."

All I would say is that if someone is having hallucinations and severe delusions, how "conscious" and rational are they in their actions? Would he in those circumstances have even checked the bag that he was being asked to carry? Would he even have known what was in the bag?

You are right that the Chinese government which totally controls the legal system has a severe penal code. But I do feel even by the standards of their own legal system, as I wrote in my reply to RoddersUk just above your post, I do think there has been a miscarriage of justice here.

All the best
David

[one eyed jack]

David, you took the time to post the link so it would be rude for me not to read it.

Having read it (and I would urge others to do the same before beign so quick to decide what side of the fence they are on with this), the following passage caught my attention:

Akmal told the officials that he did not know anything about the drugs, and that the suitcase did not belong to him. He aided the Chinese authorities with their inquiries and it appears that he told them as much as he could about the incident. Despite this, the Court sentenced him to death in October 2008.


This at least explains my why i am opposed to the death penalty and besides that, China deserves much harsher words for not exhausting this channel of inquiry before putting what may appear to be, an innocent man to his death.

While we were wasting our time on the importnace of this mans bi polarity it might have served him best if it was just said the man was innocent and duped into being an unwitting mule.

Valuable time was lost in semantics. Now he is dead leaving a family of 5 children.

[David Johnson]

"People who are bi-polar are capable of distinguishing right from wrong and there must have been a cold clear moment of decision when this guy decided to do what he did."

And your proof that he knew what was in the bag is what exactly? Because presumably he would have acted like any rational person by checking what was in the bag at every stage?

I guess that is my point, if you are suffering from delusions and hallucinations, you don't act rationally, do you?

As I stated in my reply to Rodders, obviously the Chinese have their own legal system, but that isnt to say as with any country's legal system, there can't be a miscarriage of justice. I believe this is one.

Cheers
D

[one eyed jack]

Just the following passage told me all O needed to know and that is the chinese authorities didnt even bother look into this guys story.

He was caught with it and therefore guilty.

Whetherh he is innocent of the crime is another matter but where Im from you would check the validity of a mans claim first before deciding he was a liar.

Bi polarity would only be used to back up a case not be the reason for his committing the offence and I htink this is where it has all fallen down and cost him his life.

If hwe was innocent then steps should be still taken even if the chinese government will not pay compensation.

They are also known for charging the bullet to the executed persons family.

[David Johnson]

Hi
On reflection I think I might have misunderstood what you meant when you said "The fucking drug smuggler aint (British).

If you didnt mean that it's something to do with his colour, then I apologise for putting 2 and 2 together to make 143.
If you did mean that it was something to do with his colour, then I don't, lol!

Cheers
D

[David Johnson]

Hi
He told the Chinese police that the bag belonged to a guy who was due to travel on the following day's flight. When they turned up with the police the next day to do a "sting", the guy, not surprisingly, wasnt on the flight. At that point he was rearrested and then convicted.

In that scenario, the mental illness does become very relevant because unless someone was mentally retarded, any rational person would be very suspicious about being asked to carry someone else's bag on a flight and would check to see what was in it.

Cheers
D