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I don't know the rules but we all know that players can get a yellow card for persistent fouling, even though the fouls they do get booked for isn't all that bad, it's the persistence after multiple warnings that is the main factor.

Mascherano was consistently telling the ref to FUCK OFF at every decision. Maybe the ref finally got fed up with this constant abuse and quite rightly sent the little gobshiite off.

And before you start saying the ref was bias, remember Carragher tripped Rooney in the box in the 4th minute. He was last man and if the penalty was awarded he'd have gone and potentially played the game a goal down and had 10 men for 90 mins instead of 35.

Carragher & Rafa owe Rooney a few drinks for trying to stay on his feet because if that had been Ronaldo, Gerrard, Tevez or Torres, they'd have gone down for the penalty.

Oh get lost.

If you get booked for persistent fouling, then Vidic and Ferdinand would have both got two yellows each in the first half, for persistantly fouling Torres, yet every time anybody went near that big girl Ronaldo, then the ref blew up.

As for your supposed honesty with Rooney then I'm touched but you forgot to mention the two blatant dives by Ronaldo, that both went unpunished.

The referee was a homer, but then why should we be surprised about that. It's just par for the course at Old Trafford.

As I said before then Liverpool would probably have lost the game anyway, thanks to Reina's 2 clangers, and the fact that for the first 35 mins we were 2nd best as well, but we were by no means out of it at that stage, until the ref intervened and completely ruined a perfectly good game of football, with one of the daftest decisions I have ever seen in football.

Whatever Ronaldo, Vidic or Ferdinand did -while I think you're bias and exaggerating- all this was a long time after Carragher should have been sent off. You SHOULD have been down to 10 men within 4 minutes.

Liverpool players were even complaining about the fouls that went FOR them!

Btw, I'm not a Man Utd fan. I'm just calling the match as I saw it.

The refs performance is just a convenient smoke-screen for Liverpool's failure............AGAIN.

Here we go again.

I said in my first post that Liverpool would probably have lost the game anyway and I said that before the game. You might also note that I said Liverpool "were" 2nd best for the first 35 mins. Or didn't you read that bit?

The fact is week in week out and game in and game out Manchester United get just about every refereeing decision go for them at Old Trafford and on the very rare occasion that one doesn't go for them i.e. Portsmouth in the Cup then the rest of us have to hear you lot winge on and on about how you were robbed but when somebody else moans about the ref then we're either bad losers or not good enough.

You're all hypocrites.

It was you who said the ref was a homer; it was you who said it was 12 against 10.

I'm just pointing out that the ref was not a homer because he didn't give a penalty, he didn't send Carragher off, Mascherano had more than 2-3 chances from the ref with his persistent swearing and dissent, Torres went in on a pretty bad tackle while he was on a yellow...enough for Rafa to bring him off before he'd have been sent off, and after all this the ref ignored Carragher who was shouting in the ref's face after everything that happened.

I thought the ref was being lenient -Mascherano aside- on Liverpool players just to keep a lid on the match.

[quote]the rest of us have to hear you lot winge on and on about how you were robbed but when somebody else moans about the ref[/quote]

Didn't YOU read MY post? I'm not a Man Utd fan. Again, I'm calling it as I saw it.

I think the dicipline problem needs to be highlighted.In Rugby and Cricket i understand it's only the captain that can dispute 'dubious' refereeing decisions,in a friendly and polite manner.But if the players are going to be punished for calling the referee all sorts of names,what does that mean for us fans,who,let's face it,are just as bad.

Mark Clattenburg handled the Chelsea v Arsenal game on Sunday quite well,but he did have words with the two captains before kick off,and it seemed to work-apart from Ballack and Eboue having the odd whinge,which was much ado about nothing.

maybe the captains should take more responsibility.It's either that or start deducting points from clubs that show blatant comtempt towards the ref's,as fines do players no harm whatsoever.

Mike_CFC wrote:

> I think the dicipline problem needs to be highlighted.In Rugby
> and Cricket i understand it's only the captain that can dispute
> 'dubious' refereeing decisions,in a friendly and polite
> manner.

That's absolutely correct. The captain can only ask for a clarification of the decision given by the referee or umpire. When a rugby player has been called over to the ref for a talking to he calls the ref 'sir'.

That's probably the most reasonable and rational take on it at that I've heard since Sunday.

Personal my views are very similar to Andy Gray's here

It's interesting to see him draw reference to the Steven Gerrard incident in the 2nd half that I mentioned. Surely that's dissent but that one goes unpunished and it's the old adage about consistancy of refereeing that crops up time and time again.

Personally I'm all for more respect for the refs as this has gone on for years and it is wrong but it has to be every referee that takes the same line and not just one doing it on his own, which appeared to be the case last weekend.

I also get fed up with the hypocrisy of it all. Fergie and Carlos Quieroz agreeing with the ref, yet in Wayne Rooney they have the player who probably gives the refs the most foul mouthed abuse in the entire Premier Lge.