I receved a telephone call the other day re a certian escort agency who apparently are using well known glamour models pictures and details on their site.
I wondered if anyone could tell me the legal position on this (the site was shut down before because of this but has now come back again).
I have absolutely no issue with the models if they are doing this as i believe in fredom of choice etc but as i run an agency the information would be helpful.
Michelle Magik Models.
[address of suspect agency removed, in accordance with section 2.3 of faq - woodgnome]
Escort Agencies
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marcusallen
Re: Escort Agencies
I have an escort agency.
In order for you or anyone else to stop this practice or indeed take any action would need a Civil Action under one of a number of Codes. Hence would be costly, time-consuming and probably pointless.
There are message boards for the trade where you could make your points clear.
The alternative would be to speak to the agency in question and point out the error of their ways.
Further info can be had from me directly and has no place on this forum.
In order for you or anyone else to stop this practice or indeed take any action would need a Civil Action under one of a number of Codes. Hence would be costly, time-consuming and probably pointless.
There are message boards for the trade where you could make your points clear.
The alternative would be to speak to the agency in question and point out the error of their ways.
Further info can be had from me directly and has no place on this forum.
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zipper
Re: Escort Agencies
If they are using copyright photographs without permission (which I assume they are), you must email them/their ISP to demand that the take them off the site within ?? hours or days.
If they refuse to acknowledge your email, then persue the ISP with a big legal stick, and they will close the site down I presume.
Remeber to keep a copy of your emails, and also if you have the address of the ISP, then dash a recorded letter to them with the same details.
The only problem is, these Escort agencies close down and pop up the next day, so it's always difficult to pin them down, and also the ISP might be outside the UK.
Difficult one.
Zipper
If they refuse to acknowledge your email, then persue the ISP with a big legal stick, and they will close the site down I presume.
Remeber to keep a copy of your emails, and also if you have the address of the ISP, then dash a recorded letter to them with the same details.
The only problem is, these Escort agencies close down and pop up the next day, so it's always difficult to pin them down, and also the ISP might be outside the UK.
Difficult one.
Zipper
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MisterC
Re: Escort Agencies
I agree 100% with the points Marcus and Zipper made. Should you wish to 'up the ante' you should make Customs & Excise and the Inland Revenue aware of this business, so that they can make sure appropriate records and statutory deductions and payments are taking place.
Give me a shout if you any more information.
MrC
Give me a shout if you any more information.
MrC
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Michelle Louise
Re: Escort Agencies
Hi, i hope that i have not caused any offence but i myself have had this problem with an escort agency taking pics and details and putting them on a site without my permission and then were contacting me on a daily basis with offers of work which were politely declined.
As i have already have said i have absolutely no problems with girls who do thid type of work as some of my very good friends do.
I just wondered what would happen if an agency bought pictures legally or had taken them illegally what my or other peoples legal position would be.
Michelle.
As i have already have said i have absolutely no problems with girls who do thid type of work as some of my very good friends do.
I just wondered what would happen if an agency bought pictures legally or had taken them illegally what my or other peoples legal position would be.
Michelle.
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MisterC
Re: Escort Agencies
I'm making the assumption here that the model has worked for a photographer on a model release and the photographer has then resold the images to various third parties.
First lets cover whether there any limitations on usage in the model release. If the model placed limitations on usage in the original release then the photographer has a duty of care to make certain that these are communicated to the third party - a similar principle to a restrictive covenant on a house - the model could then take action against the photographer if this did not happen and against the website owner if it was ignored. The website could also recover any fees from the photographer if any limitations were not communicated. Most releases I have seen however have no limits on usage and distribution, so this point is likely to be irrelevant.
The next issue is whether portraying an adult model as an escort could be seen as defamation if she does not escort. Potentially yes in my eyes as adult modelling and escorting are totally different, but in front of a middle class, middle aged judge, the distinction could be minimal.
If however the agency has not licensed usage of the images correctly then this would be a breach of copyright, once again in the UK this is a civil rather than criminal offence. This would however have to be done by the copyright holder.
As you can see there legal remedies available, but they are not straightforward and will not be funded by legal aid - I work on the basis that a civil case costs a minimum of ?3K for each party, therefore ?6K if you lose and there is certainly no guarantee of success and recovering any damages would be extremely difficult.
There is a possibility that they could be prosecuted for behaviour likely to cause distress and harrassment and breaches of various telecommunications acts, but once again I think the police would not be too concerned unless explicit or threatening behaviour. Even a basic injunction to stop them contacting you would cost ?1K unless you want to read some very boring books and do a ligigant in person. Legal aid could be available for this only if you could prove a very low income.
Its best to stick to the practical solutions offered by Marcus & Zipper - make sure relevant 'specialist' forums are aware of this scam and get the site pulled by the host in conjunction with copyright holder if its not you. If they are calling you on a landline get a caller ID display or get male friends to answer the phone and tell them in no uncertain terms to lay-off.
If you want me to try and explain all the legal mumbo-jumbo in a more sraightforward way or have further questions then please e-mail.
MrC
First lets cover whether there any limitations on usage in the model release. If the model placed limitations on usage in the original release then the photographer has a duty of care to make certain that these are communicated to the third party - a similar principle to a restrictive covenant on a house - the model could then take action against the photographer if this did not happen and against the website owner if it was ignored. The website could also recover any fees from the photographer if any limitations were not communicated. Most releases I have seen however have no limits on usage and distribution, so this point is likely to be irrelevant.
The next issue is whether portraying an adult model as an escort could be seen as defamation if she does not escort. Potentially yes in my eyes as adult modelling and escorting are totally different, but in front of a middle class, middle aged judge, the distinction could be minimal.
If however the agency has not licensed usage of the images correctly then this would be a breach of copyright, once again in the UK this is a civil rather than criminal offence. This would however have to be done by the copyright holder.
As you can see there legal remedies available, but they are not straightforward and will not be funded by legal aid - I work on the basis that a civil case costs a minimum of ?3K for each party, therefore ?6K if you lose and there is certainly no guarantee of success and recovering any damages would be extremely difficult.
There is a possibility that they could be prosecuted for behaviour likely to cause distress and harrassment and breaches of various telecommunications acts, but once again I think the police would not be too concerned unless explicit or threatening behaviour. Even a basic injunction to stop them contacting you would cost ?1K unless you want to read some very boring books and do a ligigant in person. Legal aid could be available for this only if you could prove a very low income.
Its best to stick to the practical solutions offered by Marcus & Zipper - make sure relevant 'specialist' forums are aware of this scam and get the site pulled by the host in conjunction with copyright holder if its not you. If they are calling you on a landline get a caller ID display or get male friends to answer the phone and tell them in no uncertain terms to lay-off.
If you want me to try and explain all the legal mumbo-jumbo in a more sraightforward way or have further questions then please e-mail.
MrC
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pervy pete
Re: Escort Agencies
As a photographer, I regularly fing my copyright photos being illegally published on website - often paysites! I haven't seen any advertising escorts on the web but often saw them in phone box cards, although, of course the escort was not the model in the photo.
Question: How does one establish the identity of a website ISP? I have found, for example www.bustymania.com/uk is illegally including my photos on his site and even invites visitors to pay to see my picytures! I've written a number of times, the owner has been abusive and claimed they were "public domain" as many were scanned from mags (also illegal), but eventually he agreed to remove them. He has not done so and now won't reply to Email. How do I find out who his ISP is?
Thanks
Pete
Question: How does one establish the identity of a website ISP? I have found, for example www.bustymania.com/uk is illegally including my photos on his site and even invites visitors to pay to see my picytures! I've written a number of times, the owner has been abusive and claimed they were "public domain" as many were scanned from mags (also illegal), but eventually he agreed to remove them. He has not done so and now won't reply to Email. How do I find out who his ISP is?
Thanks
Pete
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MisterC
Re: Escort Agencies
He(213.186.36.182) is using Verotel for billing sales@verotel.com and is hosted by these people (obtained using Sam Spade http://samspade.org/ ):
inetnum: 213.186.32.0 - 213.186.39.255
netname: OVH
descr: SARL Ovh
descr: France
country: FR
admin-c: OK217-RIPE
tech-c: OK217-RIPE
status: ASSIGNED PA
notify: noc@ovh.net
mnt-by: OVH-MNT
changed: hostmaster@ripe.net 20010130
source: RIPE
route: 213.186.32.0/19
descr: OVH ISP
descr: Paris, France
origin: AS16276
notify: noc@ovh.net
mnt-by: OVH-MNT
changed: noc@ovh.net 20010217
source: RIPE
person: Octave Klaba
address: SARL OVH
address: 140, quai du sartel
address: 59100 Roubaix
phone: +33 3 20 20 09 57
fax-no: +33 3 20 20 09 58
nic-hdl: OK217-RIPE
changed: tech@ovh.net 19991222
source: RIPE
inetnum: 213.186.32.0 - 213.186.39.255
netname: OVH
descr: SARL Ovh
descr: France
country: FR
admin-c: OK217-RIPE
tech-c: OK217-RIPE
status: ASSIGNED PA
notify: noc@ovh.net
mnt-by: OVH-MNT
changed: hostmaster@ripe.net 20010130
source: RIPE
route: 213.186.32.0/19
descr: OVH ISP
descr: Paris, France
origin: AS16276
notify: noc@ovh.net
mnt-by: OVH-MNT
changed: noc@ovh.net 20010217
source: RIPE
person: Octave Klaba
address: SARL OVH
address: 140, quai du sartel
address: 59100 Roubaix
phone: +33 3 20 20 09 57
fax-no: +33 3 20 20 09 58
nic-hdl: OK217-RIPE
changed: tech@ovh.net 19991222
source: RIPE