Poor, poor man. I feel so sorry.
David Shayler
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stripeysydney
- Posts: 1254
- Joined: Fri Jul 14, 2017 2:40 am
Re: David Shayler
Hell of an advertisment for the Security Services isn't he?
It strikes me that to be able to work for M.I.5. etc, not only do you have to be incompetant, could be a paedo (Geoffrey Prime) Get/lose your laptop in a winebar(along with getting stabbed by Yardies) Hanging round bogs for some action, have little social skills, common sense? forget it. Social misfit, yes, you'll fit right in.
On the other hand we have just basically handed death sentences to a hundred or so Iraqi's, who were willing to die for us in Iraq while working as translators. By refusing to allow them to come to good ol' blighty, while other European countries have done the honourable thing and allowed their translators to be allowed residence in said countries.
Now I have'nt aquired a degree in classics from Oxbridge, but I think that the best people to keep track of Osama and his nutty crew might just be the ones we have just shat on. After all, one so-called security expert stated a while ago that it was "quite difficult to infilitrate these organisations." I suppose that could quite well be true, if your name is, say, Rupert, Jeremy, or Tarquin and have blondish or ginger hair and a stammer like that twat Hugh Grant.
James Bond this is not.
It strikes me that to be able to work for M.I.5. etc, not only do you have to be incompetant, could be a paedo (Geoffrey Prime) Get/lose your laptop in a winebar(along with getting stabbed by Yardies) Hanging round bogs for some action, have little social skills, common sense? forget it. Social misfit, yes, you'll fit right in.
On the other hand we have just basically handed death sentences to a hundred or so Iraqi's, who were willing to die for us in Iraq while working as translators. By refusing to allow them to come to good ol' blighty, while other European countries have done the honourable thing and allowed their translators to be allowed residence in said countries.
Now I have'nt aquired a degree in classics from Oxbridge, but I think that the best people to keep track of Osama and his nutty crew might just be the ones we have just shat on. After all, one so-called security expert stated a while ago that it was "quite difficult to infilitrate these organisations." I suppose that could quite well be true, if your name is, say, Rupert, Jeremy, or Tarquin and have blondish or ginger hair and a stammer like that twat Hugh Grant.
James Bond this is not.
Re: David Shayler
Shayler went to Dundee University. He was a committed socialist. That's why he saw fit to disclose information about the monitoring of Labour politicans, notably Mandy. Quite clearly he has an ego that would give Kilroy-Silk a run for his money. His current apparent insanity would indicate that he is an atypical product of MI5, but there are mavericks in every organisation.
The British intelligence services do an incredibly difficult job, and the range of people they have working for them is exceptionally diverse in every way; for example a criminal record is no impediment to joining. The Oxbridge cliche you paint isn't even true any more of desk men like Shayler.
They have a had a massive recruitment drive for people with Islamic and/or Arabic backgrounds. Who knows how well infiltration is going? Splinter cells are notoriously difficult to track because they are so small, the network is so fractured and membership tends to be kept 'in the family'.
Our intelligence services are apparently some of the best in the world, although nowhere near the Israelis'. One of the problems with the fiasco in Afghanistan and Iraq is that US intelligence is allegedly poor, with a dearth of men on the ground and conflict between the agencies.
The whole Spook arena is, by its nature, sinister and unknowable, but I don't buy the 'they're all a bunch of fucking, queer toffs who don't know their arse from their elbow' stance.
The British intelligence services do an incredibly difficult job, and the range of people they have working for them is exceptionally diverse in every way; for example a criminal record is no impediment to joining. The Oxbridge cliche you paint isn't even true any more of desk men like Shayler.
They have a had a massive recruitment drive for people with Islamic and/or Arabic backgrounds. Who knows how well infiltration is going? Splinter cells are notoriously difficult to track because they are so small, the network is so fractured and membership tends to be kept 'in the family'.
Our intelligence services are apparently some of the best in the world, although nowhere near the Israelis'. One of the problems with the fiasco in Afghanistan and Iraq is that US intelligence is allegedly poor, with a dearth of men on the ground and conflict between the agencies.
The whole Spook arena is, by its nature, sinister and unknowable, but I don't buy the 'they're all a bunch of fucking, queer toffs who don't know their arse from their elbow' stance.
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stripeysydney
- Posts: 1254
- Joined: Fri Jul 14, 2017 2:40 am
Re: David Shayler
Yes, they were really on the ball over "The weapons of mass destruction fiasco". The Yanks stating that, "Saddam has acquired the necessary components for building an explosive device utilizing Uranium hexaflouride cake (sponge?) From the republic of Niger.
To which Tone' Blair, once he'd removed his tongue from Bush's arse said "Oh yes, this is absolutely true, cos someone told me it was".
One of the top operatives of the C.I.A. recently gave an interview in the Daily Telegraph (Not exactly left wing) that most of the agents in that organization was Male, white, W.A.S.P. and in the American venacular,'Jocks. These defenders of democracy to a man were mysogenistic towards any female in the organization, very few could speak a foreign language and to say 'had a narrow view of the world would be an understatement'.
One militery strategist once commented whether spying actually provided any usefulness to our overall security. He doubted that it did.
Quote.
The whole Spook arena is, by its nature, sinister and unknowable, but I don't buy the 'they're all a bunch of fucking, queer toffs who don't know their arse from their elbow' stance.
I know it was a quite a while ago, but do the names, Philby, Burgess, Maclean and Blunt ring a bell.
Having said all that, when I have been in Italy I had been conversing with my Italian friends about the security services, they were just as dismissive about theirs and they also thought that their cops had the I.Q. of an amoeba. So perhaps it's a cultural thingy, nobody likes a nosy bastard.
To which Tone' Blair, once he'd removed his tongue from Bush's arse said "Oh yes, this is absolutely true, cos someone told me it was".
One of the top operatives of the C.I.A. recently gave an interview in the Daily Telegraph (Not exactly left wing) that most of the agents in that organization was Male, white, W.A.S.P. and in the American venacular,'Jocks. These defenders of democracy to a man were mysogenistic towards any female in the organization, very few could speak a foreign language and to say 'had a narrow view of the world would be an understatement'.
One militery strategist once commented whether spying actually provided any usefulness to our overall security. He doubted that it did.
Quote.
The whole Spook arena is, by its nature, sinister and unknowable, but I don't buy the 'they're all a bunch of fucking, queer toffs who don't know their arse from their elbow' stance.
I know it was a quite a while ago, but do the names, Philby, Burgess, Maclean and Blunt ring a bell.
Having said all that, when I have been in Italy I had been conversing with my Italian friends about the security services, they were just as dismissive about theirs and they also thought that their cops had the I.Q. of an amoeba. So perhaps it's a cultural thingy, nobody likes a nosy bastard.
Re: David Shayler
I don't disagree with your assessment of the US intelligence agencies, but it's fairly clear that the Bush regime has systematically ignored their findings and advice, as they did with US military recommendations of non-intervention, but attempted to make them scapegoats retrospectively.
The US has always been insular, and the whole Frat-boy dynamic of their agencies is well documented. European agencies have different traditions, partly as a legacy of WW2 and the Cold War, where theatres of interest were in our back yard. I think we're also better at counter-insurgency activities becasue of Northern Irelan, but then what do I really know?
Talking about Blunt et al is totally irrelevant. The UK's institutions and attitudes have changed almost beyond recognition during the last 40 years. MI5 and MI6 are simply not a gentleman's club any more. Whether they're idiots neither you nor I have any way of knowing.
To be honest the whole area of intelligence services is beyond dodgy anyway: barely accountable, beyond the law, effectively, and built on lies and deception. Much like our leaders, actually.
In porn we trust.
The US has always been insular, and the whole Frat-boy dynamic of their agencies is well documented. European agencies have different traditions, partly as a legacy of WW2 and the Cold War, where theatres of interest were in our back yard. I think we're also better at counter-insurgency activities becasue of Northern Irelan, but then what do I really know?
Talking about Blunt et al is totally irrelevant. The UK's institutions and attitudes have changed almost beyond recognition during the last 40 years. MI5 and MI6 are simply not a gentleman's club any more. Whether they're idiots neither you nor I have any way of knowing.
To be honest the whole area of intelligence services is beyond dodgy anyway: barely accountable, beyond the law, effectively, and built on lies and deception. Much like our leaders, actually.
In porn we trust.